Twins leaning toward Livan for Opening Night
Posted on March 11th, 2008 – 11:49 AMBy Joe Christensen
FORT MYERS — Twins manager Ron Gardenhire said today that the team is leaning toward Livan Hernandez for an Opening Night starter.
“We’re kind of trying to go with [Hernandez], but we’ll see how everything goes,” Gardenhire said. “He should be the guy. … I was kind of leaning that way, but wait and see what happens as we go along here.”
Hernandez, who makes his third start of the spring today against Tampa Bay, is 1-0 with a 10.80 ERA.
“Actually, the first couple times [including live batting practice sessions] we enjoyed the heck out of it. Last time was what you see a veteran sometimes going up and trying to work on grips and spinning the ball, and so we’ll just move past that.
“He knows how to pitch. He’s done it, he’s proven himself in this league, and I think he probably has another level. I hope. I think. … We’ve seen it before so we’ve kind of learned not to panic.”
NOTE: Brittni Wangsness, 17, from Geneva, Minn., is throwing out a ceremonial first pitch before today’s game.
Brittni was on a trip with her family arranged by “Wishes and More,” an organization that makes wishes come true for youngsters with serious ailments.
Brittni’s wish was to come to spring training and meet Joe Mauer, her sports hero. Brittni was able to have a long conversation with Mauer this morning. He gave her a signed bat and other souvenirs.
She presented him with a favorite food: white cupcakes with white frosting. Brittni went to the nearby Food Fresh market early this morning to help decorate the cupcakes.
Jack Nelson, the Twins’ coordinator of community relations in spring training, said: “We’re lucky to have Joe and so many other great guys on this team. Sometimes, I feel like Santa Claus, when we’re able to help arrange a meeting like this.”
76 Responses to "Twins leaning toward Livan for Opening Night"
The sooner Livian starts and stinks, the sooner they cut him. I have no problem with this decision, if he’s on the team, get it over with quickly.
I view this as a goodwill jesture towards Torii Hunter in his return to Minnesota.
You’ve got to be kidding me!
I pay for tickets to the opener and the Twins reward me by starting Livan? I would like the Twins to at least have a chance to win. I guess I’ll be seeing a lot of the bullpen on the 31st.
Unless Baker is injured he should be starting. He gives the team the best chance to win.
Great story about the young girl. Not such a great story about Hernandez being the opening night starter. I look at him as a 3-4th starter…
Thanks for the info, Joe. I’ll plan on skipping the opener. Livan may know how to pitch, but he’s a punching bag now. Why would the Twins want 200 innings from a pitcher who gives up a run an inning?
I know we complain about not having enough spring training and minor league stuff in the print trib, but the story about Britney is a great example of why the blogging trib can be just as great!
I can’t buy the “Livan has already proved it” theory.
He proved it until 2004.
Since then his numbers have gradually deteriorated.
YEAR ERA
2004 3.60
2005 3.98
2006 4.83
2007 4.93
And the Twins think he is going to return to 2004 level on Opening Day, because he is just using ST to fine tune his pitches.
Don’t let Livan block Blackburn, Humber, Perkins, Slowey and Mulvey from developing.
I’m also disappointed by this decision. He’s the most “veteran” on the staff. And perhaps they don’t think one of the other youngsters will be able to handle the pressure…who knows.
But yeah, I’d like to have seen Livian serve as the 4th guy in the rotation. Not the front end guy.
normal ritual is to have your ace start opening day, but in this case i dont think they are looking at livan as the ace of this staff- more like th e 4-5 man but in this case, just let the veteran take care of the pressures of opening nite…it may be ok, but my choice would be boof, but alot more will be told as the next 2 weeks go by…
What?!?!? He really is nuts. I mean I’d rather see Baker, Boof, or the Franchise pitching the opener than Hernadez!
Did we get the feel good story to talk people out of wanting to puke over the Livan storyline?
OMG. Well, the good news is we’ll find out he’s washed up sooner.
I think I saw this movie already, but isn’t there already a team in Miami? After watching Hernandez stretch ten hits and six runs over four innings in two hours, no one is coming back to the dome the next day.
I disagree with everyone so far. Livan is the ONLY arm that can potentially throw for an entire season. How many other guys on the staff have played have played in the majors for an entire season?
I think management would be stupid not to put Livan at the head of the rotation, the young guys need to learn from someone (on both what to do and what NOT to do).
I disagree with everyone so far. Livan is the ONLY arm that can potentially throw for an entire season. How many other guys on the staff have played have played in the majors for an entire season?
None of the other pitchers can “potentially throw for an entire season?” You’re basing this on what, exactly?
How many other guys on the staff have played have played in the majors for an entire season?
Boof pitched for a whole season last year. He’s got 39 major league starts under his belt. Baker started 24 games last year. He’s go 50 major league starts under his belt. Both these guys have a better chance of pitching through the sixth inning than Hernandez.
diz,
Ponson and Ortiz also have played in the majors for an entire season.
Livan has ERA’s of 4.83 and 4.93 in 2006-7.
I would rather go with Blackburn, Humber, Perkins, Slowey or Mulvey who still have to prove they can fail for an entire season.
I view Livan as a 4th-5th starter….in the NL.
Seriously, Gardy needs more common sense.
However, the $5 million decision to pitch Livan has already been made, so I am just hollering in an empty room.
We start with a four game series with the Angels, right?
Maybe this is Gardy’s plan to give us the best chance of winning the last three…we throw our worst starter against their best, thereby matching up our best starter against their number 2 in game 2, our second best against their number three in game three…
Nah. Never mind.
Sad part is, I actually was thinking the same thing myself Chief. Highly, Highly doubt that is the case, but man, it makes for great rumors 
I think we would be better off throwing Faribault’s own Joe Christensen out there opening night.
This season will be a Tilt-a-Whirl ride for the Livan Large.
Ramon Ortiz part 2?
Why not, usafchief? Maybe it isn’t being planned in such a conniving way by Gardy, but it’ll still have the same effect.
This Gardy disclosure is tantamount to saying there is no ace on the Twins. So why mess with Baker’s head and bring all the attention on him opening day.
Looking for an opening-series split with the Angels.
Meantime, Livan was okay in today’s game.
And usafchief, Everett has a couple doubles and is hitting .286 which is great news.
I think E-9 could be right,, anyway the sooner he looks bad the better,, and he,ll be gone,,, yes Everett is comming around,,, and he,s lisining to his hitting coach,, it pays off,,
Maybe this is a ploy by Gardy to “light a fire” under the other starters to show the #1 spot is ripe for the picking?
So Gardy is going with the guy who has actually started on opening day before. God forbid if Brad Radke was still around to be the opening day starter, he had less than Livan.
I just love how you guys can rip Gardy for being a terrible manager, yet have him using Livan as a ploy to motivate the other starters and starting him opening day to get better matchups later in the opening series. Personally, I think he is starting Livan to get Slowey matched against Robertson in our last series vs. Detroit. Honestly
For the Division lead, of course
BC, isn,t going to like this,, but I,am leaning torwd Span, to start CF. didn,t really know much about him before ST. but he looks good now, as far as knowing the plate and how to swing,,not just hacking at everything.I,am not against going outside and getting more help, maybe Crisp,,, now that we have seen our guys, and not liking them as much,,
Should have done more key-boarding as a kid,,,, instead of playing baseball
popbelly
nah, I think baseball was the way to go.
Span does seem to know how to work the zone. they have too many CF to bring in another one though. Are you going to put the bottom guy down at A ball??. That would be rough, in competition of MLB job and down to A when you get beat out.
If Span wins the job, Gomez and Pridie go to AAA with Gomez in center and Pridie moving around the outfield.
If Gardy/Bill Smith whoever is calling these shots better think a little more on these decisions because I think we all are expecting less from the twins but we ARE not giving up. I have said this before lets let the young guys play and give up runs and make mistakes(gomez casilla). They are young lets see what they have. We may surprise some people. We are not that bad but lets not get off to a horrible start. I dont want to see Livan, steve carlton etc etc just to see maybe we can win. Maybe I am wrong but if we struggle lets do it with young and agressive personel. Twins seem to take on pitching just like the vikings do with quarterbacks. Lets get a vet and he can give us .500. If the twins would of been more agressive during trade time last year we may not lose Torrii. If anyone paid attention it was not all about the money. It was where the team stood on moving forward. I dont disagree for letting torrii go because we did not have funds but lets NOT go out and try to get someone to help we traded our best player for a minor leaguer. The talent was there. Trading Castilla last year was not a good thing and a lot of people looked at that as giving up. Including A LOT of baseball gurus. Enough with my gripping I just dont want .500 with a bunch players who will not help us next year.
Livan’s ST ERA last year was over 13.00, and he had a “decent” season. Remember Silva last spring — he had terrible numbers because he wasn’t pitching to win, he was pitching to work on things - and yet he had a “decent” season.
Livan’s not auditioning for a spot on the team, and he’s not worried (yet) about winning the game, so I’m not sure that ST results for vets really matter much.
If I could get a wish granted it would be for Livan Hernandez to not start opening day. Ok, that was in poor taste, but seriously… What a joke. I’m not even worried about his ST stats. I just think he’s washed up and has never pitched in the AL and is going to get rocked. I hope I’m wrong. More stellar Gardy decision making.
I’m with you, popbelly. Gomez clearly isn’t ready yet and I think Span deserves a shot more than Pridie does. Somebody else said it, Span on the opening day roster, Gomez in CF for Rochester with Pridie manning either corner.
Get your RF Upper Deck Seats and lower deck OF seats if there are still any available for your opening night souvenirs!!!
I am starting to hate Gardy more and more. Pridie is having the best spring training out of the three, and still he favors Gomez who has made mistake after mistake and needs more time at Rochester.
I hope Gardy and Smith are are listening to the likes of bmick.
Time to go with the players who will help us in the future. The Hernandez signing and opening-day assignment lomay be antithetical to that.
One of the reasons to be realistic about the coming season is that the W Sox are off to a good ST start.
And why do pitchers get a pass when they get smeared cuz they’re still working on their grip or trying out a new pitch, etc.?
But when Casilla, in ST, tries a pirouhet (or is it pihrana-ette?) move for a DP and fails, Gardy calls him out publicly…….and the errors are mounting for Casilla blah blah blah.
And what’s the deal with Harris? Does he want to start? Unless there’s a night-and-day change in Harris and Gomez, I’d love to see this lineup along with the solid 6 (though Kubel doesn’t look too solid yet):
8- Everett
9-Casilla
1-Span
may be antithetical…..
In other words, it looks like the old ways of the Twins.
“God forbid if Brad Radke was still around to be the opening day starter, he had less than Livan.”
Are you seriously saying that Brad Radke had less than livan? Brad Radke put together solid year after solid year and was great in the playoffs. Yet people still like to talk **** about him. I have never understood that.
mike-So Livan is already a failure,let’s get the misery over quickly.It’s suppose to be a game,not life or death.You must be Carnack or Nosterdomus(sp).With that insight,we can make a bundle on the stock market.
romer — because Casilla’s done far less than Hernandez in the major leagues. Casilla’s job this spring is to show the team that they can have confidence in him to perform at a major league level, even though he is only 23 years old. He does not accomplish that with pirouettes.
For those of you who think two weeks of ST stats matter, here’s your lineup:
C - Whiteside
1B - Ruiz
2B - Casilla
SS - Machado
3B - Lamb
OF - Young, Basak, Pridie
DH - Monroe
Rotation - Humber, Baker, Liriano, Bass, Blackburn
Bullpen - Cali, Korecky, Neshek, Guerrier, Reyes
Anyone want to take on Detroit with that team?
gbg-
is that much different from the Twins starting rotation by the end of 2008? maybe not!
You never count on the locks… young, cuddyer, morneau, mauer… those guys are just there to fine tune, and stay healthy.
I am loveing Ruiz this spring by the way, and hope he can make the team if we go with an 11 man rotation, but it’s a 12 man rotation, and I think that means that they take Buscher or Tolbert as the other backup infielder.
Let’s See, We can’t sign L Castillo because we won’t have any money, so we trade him to the Mets for two stiffs, We sign a guy who is probably 38 with ERA’s near 5 in the NL the last two years and throws an 82 MPH fastball.
He is going to be our opening day starter? What kind of “Veteran Leadership” can a guy provide who shows up to camp and can’t even run wind sprints because he is so out of shape.
I’m ticked off.
GBG,
“Livan’s ST ERA last year was over 13.00, and he had a “decent” season.”
Livan’s 4.93 ERA regular season was definitely INDECENT if not obscene.
I would like them to stick with Baker for opening day, if the Franchise isn’t ready to go.
Ruiz can only be a DH/PH. Who is Baltimore’s DH?
Here is my complete list of substantial disappointments (not close to realistic expectations) so far this ST:
Perkins
Slowey
Duensing
Punto
Harris
Tolbert
Kubel
Gomez
(Anyone else?)
So it looks like some problems with starting pitching, and a big problem at 2B.
I’m not highly worried about starting pitching. There are some other possibilities besides the above disappointments.
But 2B leaves my with a deja vu of 3B and DH last year.
Okay romer, I’ll bite.
How is Punto a disappointment? Or Gomez for that matter? Considering how terrible Punto was in 06, how could you have any sort of high hopes for him going into this season?
And for Gomez, he was a rookie rushed through the Mets system. That much was well documented. We knew he was raw when the trade came in, and that he’d have a lot of work to make the starting 9 this season.
For those of you who think two weeks of ST stats matter…
What I find more intriquing is that those people usually only say ST doesn’t count when you try to use it as some kind of positive.
But boy, when something goes wrong in ST it’s a sure sign of certain doom for 2008.
It’s funny. In a sad sort of way.
Romer,
I agree with you except I want Gomez!!! I want him because I want to see future not a stop gap. If I were to pick out of the three and I have not seen them probably pridie, gomez, and then span. I think span has just as much work as gomez. As far as Punto use him as utility or ship him off. I vote for Punto to be off the island. I can not remember who says this is not life or death. Your right but it is not but it is about making right choices and wrong choices. Let me ask you this question How long will Gardy last if he continues to play PUNTO as much as he does now. I say not long!!
bmick,
How long has it been since the Twins fired a manager?
22 years?
The Twins FO will not fire Gardy for playing Punto. (or anyone else)
Gardenhire says he will pitch Hernandez on opening day. Normally, the team will go with their best pitcher. If Hernandez is the team’s best starting pitcher, the season appears very very bad for the Twins.
“What I find more intriquing is that those people usually only say ST doesn’t count when you try to use it as some kind of positive.” - T
Exactly, T. I’m amazed at how many people argue out of both sides of their mouths. I’m all for multiple perspectives, but you can get carried away.
“gbg- is that much different from the Twins starting rotation by the end of 2008? maybe not!” - BC
You might very well be right. But my question is, are they who you want to bring north with you to start the season? Personally, I really like Humber, but of course that just makes me a Smith-loving moron (according to those on this board).
And yes, Ruiz if they go with 11 in the pen, and only then. (Holy #%@*! Did I agree with BC twice in the same post? What’s going on here?)
Maybe Gardy thought it was April Fools day or something when he announced that. I’m going to have to drink an extra 3 beers before the game to sit through Livan’s start.
One doesn’t always start their best pitcher opening day. Shilling started for the Redsox last year, and Rogers starts for the Tigers.
The choice was for experience over talent for Opening Day starting pitcher.
It has been done before. (Radke over Santana)
It will all even out when Blackburn (my choice) pitches instead of Livan in the fifth game.
Geno, if I knew what was going to happen, life would be very boring indeed. However, the stats on Mr. Hernandez have gotten worse each of the last 3-4 years, he throws in the low 80’s and his ERA was nearly 5 in the NL last year. Given the data I have, I am making an assumption about the likely outcomes generated by Livan pitching in the AL. It’s called logic. You take data, and you make predictions. Those predictions are sometimes right, and sometimes wrong. Right now, I’m predicting Livan isn’t going to have an ERA under 5, and that the Twins made a mistake in signing him. We’ve already read how he isn’t exactly a good role model in terms of work ethic….
mike-Data will probably prove you right.He has had periods of success in his career.The whole point is that the games have not began yet.Time will tell if it was a wise investment.That’s why we care about baseball.
Experience was definately a factor in Gardy’s decision. In Clevelands playoff with the Yankees, Coach Brown went with Harris over Vaughn, even though he had the better stuff. It seemed to work out alright for them.
Boof didn’t have an ERA under 5 last year and he would be the next guy in line to start opening day with Bakers being down.
am I that disagreeable that you feel it a mortal sin to agree with me twice? lol. That’s fine.
I like Ruiz off the bench, but not at the suffering of the pitching staff.
Who do I want to bring north with me if I were the twins?
Garza, Liriano, Baker, Gallagher Masterson.
CF Ellsbury
CA Mauer
DH Bonds
1B Morneau
LF Upton
RF Cuddyer
3B Feliz
SS Lowrie
2B Harris
Redmond, Pridie, Punto, Kubel
Morlan, Guerrier, Crain, Reyes, Perkins, Neshak
But that isn’t how Bill Smith, and Carl Pohlad’s wallet saw it… so I settle for being excited about Gomez, praying for Blackburn, and routing for Ruiz.
And looking forward to Humber, and Guerra, Swarzack, Sosa(the sleeper in the bunch), and Robertson by the all star break in 2009 all getting a chance in the bigs.
Pedro Feliz, are you kidding me?? He of the .290 OBP. And just how did we aquire BJ?? I don’t remember the Rays looking to trade a guy who batted .300 and hit 24 HR and can play most positions on the field. A lot of wishful thinking here on things that would never happen except in Bizzaro World
I do like the prospect of Guerra, Swarzak, Manship, Robertson, Mulvey, Humber. We have a lot of pitchers, don’t sleep on Humber as a future closer.
T-wins,
If that wasn’t a “Major League” reference in your 9:40 AM post, my desk chair is going to continue spinning for another ten minutes.
For the first ten minutes, I was thinking “What the hell is he ….?
So Boof, Nathan and Rincon, Bartlett gets us Upton and Harris, and who else??
LNP4life…
I was making a point of how I disagree with every single decision that Bill Smith has made this year, but that I’m still a fan, and I route for my team.
Upton, Harris, and Pridie
Bonser, Swarzack, Blackburn, Morales
(I should have dropped Harris or Pridie from the deal so that was an oversite on my ranting), but if we were going after a Devil Ray… Upton should have been our number 1 target as he can play CF, or 3B or 2B if we needed him to fill in.
Sean Gahallager would have been part of the deal involving Joe Nathan going to the Cubs.
I do like Lamb a bit better than Feliz, but Feliz is a much better defensive 3B, who is going to hit .250-.265 with 20 homers, and out of a 7-9 hitter defense, and power are a nice combo platter.
I am a minority, and I love Barry Bonds, and though I think he deserves prison for lying to the grand jury… I still take the numbers over anything else that is out there, and he would draw fans which is something this team needs after losing it’s two most marketable people nationally.
And everyone and their mom knows how I felt about the Red Sox…
So relax… my message was a JOKE… just a backhanded way of saying… I disagree, but this is my team so I do the best I can with what I have to work with. The bitterness is tuned low, while the hope is up high for the preseason, and I pray I can keep it going through the season, but I also reserve the right to rip Bill Smith, Carl Pohlad, and every single member of the Twins organization on and off the field any time I feel that they are not holding up their end of the bargain.
I would never have offered Rincon a contract in arbitration. He would have just been GONE
[…] leave it to Gardy to screw up the pitching staff as badly as the lineup. Reports are coming out today that he’s planning to use Livan Hernandez as the Opening Day Starter. […]
BC– not a mortal sin, just a venial one. Let’s just say we’re often on different sides of the argument — like saying Morlan would be ready for the majors this year. Was he even in the Rays’ camp?
The order of the pitching rotation only matters for the first couple of weeks and doesn’t matter again until the playoffs. Giving the opener to a young pitcher could either put to much pressure on him or make his head swell a little too much depending on his personality. They shouldn’t have signed Hernandez but now that they’ve got him he might as well pitch the opener. Although if it was up to me it would be Boof simply because most teams without a clear ace start their most established (with them) pitcher as a show of respect/appreciation.
I think Manship could have closer potential.
