Liriano heads into second start
Posted on March 12th, 2008 – 9:30 AMBy Joe Christensen
FORT MYERS — Francisco Liriano will make his second start of the spring today, as the Twins play host to the Boston Red Sox at Hammond Stadium. He pitched 1 2/3 innings last Friday in his first start.
The Fort Myers Mayor’s Cup is on the line. The series is tied 2-2 heading into this deciding fifth game.
Twins lineup
1. Carlos Gomez, CF
2. Joe Mauer, C
3. Michael Cuddyer, RF
4. Justin Morneau, 1B
5. Delmon Young, LF
6. Jason Kubel, DH
7. Brendan Harris, 2B
8. Brian Buscher, 3B
9. Adam Everett, SS
Starting pitcher: LH Francisco Liriano.
Red Sox lineup
TBA
Starting pitcher: RH Clay Buchholz.
78 Responses to "Liriano heads into second start"
This should be our opening day lineup and starting pitcher
no that’s almost the opening day lineup, but Gomez needs so much work, he’ll be at CF next year. Pridie shoulld be the CF but Gardy took him out of the race so by defult it should go to Span
Put in Lamb for Buscher and you do have the Twins starting lineup.
Agreed, this should be the Opening Day line-up, but with Lamb instead of Buscher.
I guess I see what Gardy’s thinking with Livan (I don’t agree, but I see the thinking) , I figured that would be the way it would go. He doesn’t want to give any of the youngsters the pressure of starting Opening Day, and Liriano could probably use an extra day or two. After the first go-round, who cares who’s first. They all go every 5th day.
I’ve always thought you’re better off starting your #1 as the #3-4 pitching spot in the rotation so he gets more wins and doesn’t have to face a Cy Young candidate every game.
KB,
my view exactly, who cares who pitches the first game. You could change it after the first off day anyway. Last year they mainly used a 4 man rotation for the first 6 weeks.
I like Monroe over Kubel if its the opening day lineup.
No it’ll be Kubel if they face a righthander on opening day
Gomez will be in CF on opening day. Remember, this is the team that had Ford and Tyner on the bench.
Kubel will get first chance, that’s the Twins way. If he goes to the bench, he’ll go down dobber for sure.
I’ve still got a nickel that says the opening game lineup will be:
2B Harris
C Mauer
RF Cuddy
1B Justin
LF Young
DH Kubel
3B Lamb
SS Everett
CF Gogo
I read that the Cards are desperate and have called Lohse’s agent.
Gomez SHOULDN’T be the opening day starter, he should be a September call up. He can’t hit yet… I can see the potential in him, but the Mets rushed him. I don’t see why the Coaching staff decided to eliminate Pridie already… he’s been the most consistant and polished hitter so far… and he won’t throw it home and miss by 15 feet like Gomez does.
I like Young in the 3 spot, and gomez in CF. Buscher at 2nd. Lamb at 3rd.
Baker, opening day. yeah right, he’d crap his pants on his was out to the mound.
no but he throws like tyner…
who would you rather have? someone that can never throw someone out at home or someone who can almost all the time throw someone out?
Wonder what the Cards would give for Livan 
2B Harris
C Mauer
RF Cuddyer
1B Morneau
LF Young
DH Kubel
CF Monroe
3B Lamb
SS Everett
I’d rather have the one who never threw someone out cause he knows his limitations and will hit the cutoff man so the runners don’t advance extra bases.
I’m thinking Harris might take over in the #9 hole like they did all those years w/Rivas, Bartlett, Punto - put a piranha down there. Someone that can get on base…just a thought.
the Punto of 2006 that is!
I am loving this lineup for Liriano…
Beat the Red Sox.
Red Sox Nation needs to be destroyed!
you mean the punto that batted number 2 in front of mauer?
uh oh….. i dont like where this is going….
and btw pridie may not even get the ball to the cut off man.. (like tyner) so if he doesnt and the guy takes another base you still want pridie?
Why isn’t Monroe getting some playing time in CF? Is he just simply not an option for CF or what?
I think Span would do just nicely to start the season. If not now, when? Let the boy have his chance. He DID bat over .300 last year in AAA, and he’s got the speed for leadoff. Gomez can ripen a bit more in AAA and be our CF for the future.
Correction: Span batted over .300 AFTER the all-star break.
Correction: Span batted over .300 AFTER the all-star break. Still, not bad. Shows he adjusted and maybe matured?
Why is there more pressure on you on opening day compared to day #2? It’s still your first start of the season and the Dome will be packed. I don’t see a whole lof of difference there.
the dome is only full too boo hunter not for the opening day starter…
Pridie has an average arm at least. Better than Tyner.
The only difference is you will be pitching against John Lackey rather than whoever the Angels have as their #2 starter.
jama,
probably jared weaver as their number 2
which btw is painful to play against…
the next week to 10 days will give us a better take on gomez and span along with harris (he seems like a mystery so far) as to who should stay and who should go. span hasn’t done much more than walk a lot, gomez if he doesn’t show more at the plate maybe he needs to go down and no way punto can start every day hitting less than .100
i’m worried about our ace being a .500 pitcher with a near 5 era that doesn’t bode well for being competitive.
I really think when you have two young players like the battle for CF, you have to pick the one that will be better in the long term. If you start with Span because he’s better now, then he plays OK, but not great (likely) then how and when do you bring up Gomez?
I think they are essentially a wash, maybe Span’s a little better right now, but Gomez is better long term……therefore, my vote is for Gomez.
you’re right, he was the slotted #2, but there were days where he batted leadoff, #8, adn #9 that season - tyner was #8, Bartlett #9, Castillo leadoff, and Punto #2 - for the most part, the twins treat the #8 and #9 hole hitters like their #1 and #2 (in years past). That’s my only argument for why Harris might wind up at #9. Geesh…some people and their arrogant egos - liondragon, which league did you make it to - you’re probably like that country song - you’re so much “cooler” online - cuz you can be anything you aren’t in real life - you’re probably a coward that is afraid to ask his/her boss for a raise, but once you punch out for the day and log in to your internet, you’re the ruler of cyberspace! good for you! Sorry, there are way more important things in life than for me to worry about a little tidbit that was taken far more seriously than I had intended it to be…
jama,
That’s true for the first go-round, but after that with everyone having different off-days, it doesn’t matter after that.
I hope the lineup looks like:
1. Span, CF
2. Mauer, C
3. Young, LF
4. Morneau, 1B
5. Cuddyer, RF
6. Kubel/Monroe, DH
7. Lamb, 3B
8. Casilla, 2B
9. Everett, SS
I’ve not been impressed by Harris so far this spring, and Gomez could maybe be ready by All-Star Break. I think that Punto would probably be better at 2B, but Punto and Everett in the lineup together make my stomach turn. And I hope Casilla gets some time at SS.
I think it is instructive to see Twins Manger Gardenhire stating that Hernandez will be the opening day pitcher for the Twins. Apparently Hernandez had one good outing for four innings and he is basing his judgement about the opening day pitcher on that. It is well known that Gardenhire knows nothing about statistics. Any child could review Hernandez’s pitching record and see that he is only a 50-50 pitcher. I think Gardenhire’s hasty choice for an opening day pitcher is reflective of his poor judgement as a Manager. In 2007, Gardenhire did more to hurt the team’s success than the opposing teams did. Hopefully, he will not let his habitual platooning syndrome take over once again. But my point is that the fans need to take a really close look at Gardenhire’s decisions about the lineup and pitching rotation in 2008. The guy is simply a very poor manager. I don’t know how he got to be the Twins manger in the first place unless it was because of his name recognition. We do not like to see a team with a tremendous amount of potention to win being limited by a terrible manager.
Actually, I’d bet that John Garland starts day #2 for the Angels in April.
Herb, seriously….Gardy got the job because of name recognition? Who the hell outside of Minnesota knew who Ron Gardenhire was when Tom Kelly stepped down? The only thing “terrible” is your logic/analogy.
And as far as faulting him for habitual platooning….have you seen our roster? Outside of four players last year there wasn’t a player that deserved to be handed a starting role on this team, let alone any other team in the majors. We’re not the Yankees…you need to experiment when you are handed a bunch of major league reserves or premature minor leaguers.
Gardy is anything but a “very poor manager”. He’s done a lot for this franchise with varying degrees of talent to work with, and clearly his players love and respect him. He’s not going anywhere.
“you’re right, he was the slotted #2, but there were days where he batted leadoff, #8, adn #9 that season - tyner was #8, Bartlett #9, Castillo leadoff, and Punto #2 - for the most part, the twins treat the #8 and #9 hole hitters like their #1 and #2 (in years past). That’s my only argument for why Harris might wind up at #9. Geesh…some people and their arrogant egos - liondragon, which league did you make it to - you’re probably like that country song - you’re so much “cooler” online - cuz you can be anything you aren’t in real life - you’re probably a coward that is afraid to ask his/her boss for a raise, but once you punch out for the day and log in to your internet, you’re the ruler of cyberspace! good for you! Sorry, there are way more important things in life than for me to worry about a little tidbit that was taken far more seriously than I had intended it to be…”
lol i was taking it seriously it was just funny that you mentioned the name punto
(even more funny as the number 2 guy)
“you’re right, he was the slotted #2, but there were days where he batted leadoff, #8, adn #9 that season - tyner was #8, Bartlett #9, Castillo leadoff, and Punto #2 - for the most part, the twins treat the #8 and #9 hole hitters like their #1 and #2 (in years past). That’s my only argument for why Harris might wind up at #9. Geesh…some people and their arrogant egos - liondragon, which league did you make it to - you’re probably like that country song - you’re so much “cooler” online - cuz you can be anything you aren’t in real life - you’re probably a coward that is afraid to ask his/her boss for a raise, but once you punch out for the day and log in to your internet, you’re the ruler of cyberspace! good for you! Sorry, there are way more important things in life than for me to worry about a little tidbit that was taken far more seriously than I had intended it to be…”
lol i wasnt taking it seriously it was just funny that you mentioned the name punto
(even more funny as the number 2 guy)
wasnt not was (as you can see in the double post)
Rood Dog,
Good post.I could not agree more about what Gardy has to work with and why he can’t be faulted for his habitatual platooning.
I still don’t understand this “added” pressure of being the opening day starter. Don’t you try to pitch the best you can every game? I guess I’m just really peeved that I am going to have to boo Livan during the opener.
yup - i figured it out based on the rest of what you wrote…either way - i figure that their punchless lineup of pre-2000 through 2007 has been replaced by a much upgraded (in theory/on paper) lineup in 2008. everyone has a lot to prove besides their slotted #2, #3, & #4 hitters this year, but based on career numbers (and Punto, at best, being a utility guy) they should have a much more productive season offensively. I just hope their pitching staff can be anything above average so that they’re able to keep things competitive most days!
Sorry fella - shouldn’t have gotten so aggressive with my reply…my bad!
And whoever said that Gardy was picking Livan because of one good start in Spring Training(It wasn’t even that good a start) is absolutely crazy. Rick Anderson is the pitching coach and Gardy does whatever Anderson tells him in regards to the starting pitching.
im sure liriano will be on another pitch count today 40 maybe…
Morneau’s going deep today. Just thought I’d call that now.
If he can’t get strikes, he’ll be done after one inning…5 pitch walk to Ellsbury and full-count now to Youkilis.
This is probably a waste of time, but I’ll soldier on anyway…
IMO if Gardy has a fault with platooning, it’s that he doesn’t do enough of it.
Take a look at virtually every player’s splits, particularly LH hitters, and then tell me platooning is a bad idea.
Here’s a couple samples:
Craig Monroe (career):
vs RHP .249/.296/.425
vs LHP .273/.319/.495
Jason Kubel:
vs RHP .269/.321/.443
vs LHP .243/.318/.357
Can someone give me a good reason why Gardy shouldn’t platoon Monroe/Kubel in the DH spot?
Joe Mauer:
vs RHP .330/.419/.521
vs LHP .277/.342/.330
Mike Redmond:
vs RHP .272/.328/.331
vs LHP .332/.387/.436
If Mauer’s gonna get a day off from catching now and then, can someone tell me why you wouldn’t put Redmond in on a day a LHP is starting?
Take a good look at platoon splits for every player in major league history with over 500 total ABs. Then tell me what percentage of those players don’t have a sigificant platoon split.
Then tell me again how the Twins would win more if Gardy could just somehow avoid his “habitual platoon syndrome.”
twins bats have to come to life today…end this team slump….today it looks like opening day for both teams with just a couple exceptions or injury
Ortiz pops out in fair ground to Mauer. 2 down, Ellsbury at third…Youkilis had flied to RF, with runner advancing. Ellsbury stole second.
For all who can’t hear this one.
Manny RBI double. 1-0 Sox.
Too many Boston fans at Hammond stadium.
Lowell 5-3 grounder. Liriano over 20 pitches in first. 1-0 Boston.
did they say if he threw any sliders for strikes yet?
Liriano’s delivery is much more relaxed. He is just missing the plate on the pitches that are not strikes. Made a great pitch to Big Papi for the little pop up to Mauer. Manny laced one to right center, but overall, a pretty decent inning for The Franchise.
If Livan would have had that same first inning this board would be all over how terrible he is. I’m not a big Livan fan, but it’s funny how the perceptions change with different players.
any word on slider?
Gomez leadoff bunt, error on Bucholtz…mauer deep flyout on hit/run.
Gomez is on first, now time to steal 2nd and 3rd 
Cuddyer grounds out. Twins ran Gomez, avoided double play.
Always
This is Liriano’s second time pitching to live hitters in the last 18 months. I think he has a little longer rope than Livan who has now started 3 games and has been below average for the last 3 years.
Funky
Thanks for the play by play/updates. It’s much appreciated by those of us at work.
Morneau grouds to first, 1-0 after one.
Gladden says heater has hit 90 a couple times. Breaking pitch K on JD Drew.
Wonder if his velocity will slowly come along or if his new delivery will keep it in the high 80s, low 90s?
Varitek just bombed one on him.
only throwing 89-90 and no sliders
he hasnt thrown for 16 months. its gonna take time for his muscle to get stronger plus its only spring training. i heard nathan was only throwing 88 so far
Varitek 3-1 pitch HR to RF. 2-0 Boston.
don’t even put liriano and livan in the same sentance. total different situation!
Lowrie soft liner to second
liriano said hes waiting till regular season to open up his throwing motion
What’s Liriano’s pitch count, and how high are they gonna let it go?
bucholz is eating this twins lineup for lunch..arrghh
Some of you are very easy to get going! I feel the same way you all do about Liriano, and close to the same about Livan. Although, I’m willing to give him a little more rope than you are, but not as much as Gardy probably will and definitely not as much as Gardy gave Ponson and Ortiz last year.
Liriano is getting beat up a little today.
pitch count ended at 53–not a very good outing- but he got his work in according to mr gladden
[…] split-squad loss against the Twins, and as he did in Sunday&39s loss to Minnesota, …mlb.mlb.comLiriano heads into second startLiriano heads into second start Posted on March 12th, 2008 ?? 9:30 AM By Joe Christensen FORT MYERS […]
