Weekend check-in
Posted on March 22nd, 2008 – 7:44 PMBy Joe Christensen
As we get ready to crank up our season preview coverage next weekend, I took a break from Twins camp to check out some other teams. La Velle and Souhan were with the team today in Jupiter, staying on top of all the Nathan, Baker and Liriano news, so look for their coverage in our first editions.
(Note: We’ve been having some issues with our server, so blogging has been spotty of late. Apologies for that.)
Meanwhile, it’s prediction time, and here’s the way I’m leaning today for the AL Central:
1. Indians, 2. Tigers, 3. Twins, 4. White Sox, 5. Royals.
I know the Twins are a consensus pick to finish fourth behind the Tigers, Indians and White Sox. But this story caught my eye today, a sign that the White Sox aren’t playing hard of late, and Ozzie and Kenny are griping about it.
Also, tough for me to pick the Royals much higher when John Bale and Brett Tomko appear set to start the season as their No. 4 and No. 5 starters. This team has Luke Hochevar coming, and it’s a long season, but seems like that team has a long way to go.
39 Responses to "Weekend check-in"
Also, tough for me to pick the Royals much higher when John Bale and Brett Tomko appear set to start the season as their No. 4 and No. 5 starters.
And of course, Livan Hernandez as the Twins’ #1 starter is really striking fear in the hearts of hitters throughout the league.
“And of course, Livan Hernandez as the Twins’ #1 starter is really striking fear in the hearts of hitters throughout the league”
He’s the #1 starter by defualt, you know Liriano/Baker/Bonser are the 1/2/3. Livan as a #4 is pretty nice if you ask me, and we certainly have a better offense/bullpen. 3rd is the likely spot for the Twins.
Giving Livan the opening night start doesn’t make him our #1, like Joy said he’s actually nothing more then a 4th starter when things get rolling.
Ubelmann is the village idiot. ‘Nuff said.
5 posts before the name-calling starts. Par for the course around here, I guess.
Every year one of the Central teams overachieves and one underachieves. It’s easy to pick the Indians and Tigers at the top and the Twins/Sox in 3/4 followed by the Royals… it’s a safe pick. But I won’t be at all surprised to see Cleveland or Detroit falter and either Minnesota or Chicago turn in to a contender. All four of those teams have some talent and all four have some potential issues.
My bad… miscounted. Only 4 posts. Nice.
All the teams in the division have adequate hitting. It comes down to, who has the pitching. Of course, the pitching depends largely on which team can make the plays in the field.
I can’t believe JoeC. wrote the Twins would finish 3rd this season with a (presumably) straight face…
If this squad finishes above .500 this season, you could call it a success. I have them winning anywhere between 74-78 games and I kinda think that is too high. The central this season is going to be tough, but I do think us and the Sox (73-77) will be battling to stay out of the basement.
Detroit (97-101 wins) will take it easily, as I dont expect to see the same kind of production out of Cleveland (85-89) this year. And KC (80-84), everyone gives them a hard time, but they have made some decent acquisitions, and their young guys have tremendous upside. They will no longer be the division doormat this year.
Ubelmann is the village idiot. ‘Nuff said.
That would make a whole lot more sense if his baseball analysis and writing weren’t typically excellent.
A bit of the pot calling the kettle black, so to speak?
I thnk Joe has it right. I could never understand all the writers picking the Twins to finish fourth behind the White Sox. Chicago is a TERRIBLE organization.
I wouldn’t say the White Sox are a terrible organization. After all their World Series trophy has a little less dust on than the Twins’ last one.
HHHHMMMMMMMMM -
Meche - 3.67 ERA
Bannister - 3.87
Greinke - 3.69
I hate to break it to you “fans” and seasoned sports writers but the Royals, with their superior rotation, have a better shot at 3rd than the Twins. By the way, the White Sox have a better rotation as well. The fact is, you can’t give away the top 60% of your rotation and expect to compete.
If everything goes right the Twins could finish in third. But, oh so many things can and probably will go wrong. The rotation will probably be in shambles by June, wearing out the bullpen which will probably fade after July.
You can’t give away your best 3 starters from a team that wasn’t even .500 and be serious about being competetive.
Detroit will win going away. They have enough pitching to match that amazing lineup. They’ll need a couple healthy arms in the bullpen though to compete for the title. I think it was Leyland that said this spring something like, you can’t out mash the other team everyday, but it sure helps when you can do it every once in awhile.
See, this is the thing that’s wrong with a lot of commenting styles on these blogs:
But, oh so many things can and probably will go wrong.
They always assume the worst. As though the Twins are the only team that could possibly have something unexpected go wrong midseason.
“But, oh so many things can and probably will go wrong.”
Words to live by.
Ubes is pretty solid with his directional anaylsis. One of the better Twins bloggers out there.
The Twins rotation, although filled with solid middle of the rotation potential, it is just that, potential.
Lots of inexperience or question marks for a team to be considered a good bet to contend with the top half of the division. More likely those question marks are good reason to believe it’s likely they’ll contend for the bottom.
Oh, I don’t know - the name-calling could be seen as a hardly surprising response to the snarky negativity of Ube’s comment.
Joe C. made a pick. The gist of Ube’s comment is legit - a team that doesn’t clearly have someone better & further along to start the first game than Livan has pitching issues - but the “tone” (to the extent there’s a “tone” in words on a website) is sarcastic.
So, let’s review … Joe C. picks the Twins 3rd, Ubes mocks Joe’s analysis by reference to Livan right out of the box … and others think the ‘name-calling’ (read ‘insults’) start a few comments below comment #1?
Umm, no - it started right out of the box.
my prediction is cleveland, detroit, twins kansas city and white sox. kc is going to make its first leap in the standing this year. despite some talent the white sox are doomed to finish last and you willsee ozzie guillen fired before season end i think his act has worn out in chicago. what do you guys think?
I think it’s going to be an interesting season. I expect the Twins to come out with a chip on their shoulders, and finish the month of April in first place. The starting pitching looks good!
I think that the Twins will fight with Cleveland for the division, Detroit third and the Royals will fight with the Sox for the fourth place…
Other than Verlander, Detroit’s starters are worse than the Twins starters and their bullpen is probably one of the worse in the majors. Their line up is old and fickle and their 3B+SS may combine for 90 errors this year…
The White Sox just are not a cohesive team or a team that will work their rear ends out to win.
Cleveland overachieved last year. If they fall back to earth, Carmona has an average year (all the oracles are predicting 13-14 wins for him) and Sabathia’s contract is a distraction, I wouldn’t doubt that the Twins will finish first (esp. if the starters develop properly. Very encouraged by Bonser’s spring and the last starts of Slowey and Liriano; and there is a lot of depth)
Go Twins
Cleveland won on the basis of the HR last year. It was sneaky, cuz they didn’t have the long line of standard good hitters. I suppose it was a lot of clutch stuff.
Maybe this year scouting reports can solve the problem with them.
And Detroit is aging. Look for injuries there, although their weak bullpen could get a boost mid-season or so when Zumaya (sp?) and Rodney come back.
another tidbit about Detroit… Grandenson has a broken hand. He has been placed in the 15 day DL but probably won’t play until the AS break…
Boof has been a relief, but doesn’t seem to be progressing. Maybe he appeared at ST ready to go for the season, more or less, and is now just getting the work in and/or experimenting here and there.
But I have high hopes for him.
Looks like Jacque may be getting more playing time for Detroit with Granderson out.
T-
In Minnesota if you haven’t noticed we’ve had a 1-12 college football team, an NFL team that has a quarterback that throws like Lamar from Revenge of the Nerds with a Head Coach who thinks he’s Einstein, but does a job more like Epstein (from welcome back kotter). An NBA Team that has the Triune Failure running the club. Glen Failure, Kevin McChump, and Randy Wittless… our beloved Twins… screwed up by not signing any free agents in 06 or 07, Didn’t make any viable trades to improve in either season, Didn’t sign their players to long term contracts in 06 or 07 when they could have saved major money… traded away a future ace, their starting SS, and a future Closer for a Gifted but troubled 22 year old OF (still think they gave up too much but that’s my opinion again)… they very well may have botched their trade of their ACE by overplaying the market, and didn’t bring in any real hitters to supplement the talent we had. Young evens out with Hunter. Harris sort of evens out with Bartlett… Gomez will probably hit as well as Kubel did last year with more speed… a lot more speed, and our 3B issue isn’t 100% solved, our SS can’t hit, and our rotation is rehabbing, rookies, and retreads… with the RICHEST OWNER IN BASEBALL refusing to open his purse strings because it’s bad business, and at 312 years old he can’t afford to take a risk just to try and win games He might only be worth 4.1 Billion when the ball park opens and not 4.5 billion.
Nope… I just can’t be positive about minnesota sports teams other than the Gopher’s basketball team who are being lead by a real coach with a real work ethic. You may be able to convince me to give the Gophers football team the benefit of the doubt because they had no Defense before Brewster got here…
The rest of it… we need major overhauls, and minimal expectations or they will rip our hearts out, and we’ll get to be disappointed all year long. so welcome to the AAAA Twins season. Any expectations above that will only let you down. Set your sights low and pray to be wrong… that’s my motto.
So forgive me if it’s difficult to want to give any one of them the benefit of the doubt
coco,
Totally support what you say, but I am especially thrilled that Livan’s career is about to take off.
Not so negative BC. Wolves have bottomed out & are young with high draft picks. Wait another year or two. Vikings on slight upswing, while rest of division weakened. Will make playoffs if good health. Granted, they are a long way from Super Bowl. Twins are in better shape than in ‘84 & they won it all in ‘87. Lot’s of potential growth for most of the young players. No Twins starter now on the downside of their career. Give them a chance.
coco,
Sorry.
I just realized that you meant starting position players - not starting pitchers.
Sy, yes position players. Livan can hardly see the top of the hill anymore if he looks back.
Agreed coco, I am more optimistic about Minnesota sports than I have been for a long while. I like the direction of nearly all the sports franchises in town at this point. Sticking with the Twins for now, I think they will be a pleasant surprise this year. Around or slightly above .500, but if allot of things fall into place I think playoff contention could happen. I like the off season moves, and think it is way to early to form any judgments on the Johan trade. I can’t wait for the 31st!BC, I don’t know how you can follow so many sports so closely with that pessimistic attitude! Hang in there buddy..
coco…
I will give you the comments on the Twins and the Vikings as representing hope.
With McHale, Taylor, and Wittman I don’t care if Jesus Christ, Michael Jordan, Magic Johnson and Wilt Chamberlain in their primes were on this team. Those three dimwitted SOBs would find away to make the Wolves miss the playoffs, or lose in the 1st round. They have no ability to run an organization anywhere but straight into the ground.
The Twins are in better shape than in 84, and I still think that 2010-2011 are going to be great years, but to expect more than that from this team is a bit too much to ask for I think. They still have Punto which is 20 losses, and Gardenhire another 20 losses right there so between the games that Punto plays in, and the ones where Gardenhire makes a bad decision and pulls a pitcher and puts Rincon in the game… We are starting the season this year at 0-40…
But I will never give anything to do with McHale, Taylor and Wittman the benefit of the doubt. I would rather take a bullet than lie to myself, or anyone else and think that the Wolves are going to ever be good with those fools running the team. Never! I mean they keep beating bad teams so they screw themselves out of the lottery position… we had a 90% chance at Beasley or Rose, and now we have a 79% chance that we won’t get either… those are the only two players in this draft that could change this team overnight. So expect 3-4 more years of mediocrity at best before they become a 1 and done playoff team at best again.
BC,
I agree that the T-wolves leadership has been far from exemplary, but I don’t think the mean-spirited name-calling is necessary. Let’s see if maybe they can keep the re-building process going. I can have hope for them without lying to myself. For the record, they are supposed to try and win games, and the draft is far from a guarantee. We “should” have had Shaq,etc. They “should” get an impact player with their draft pick and let’s see who it is and then assess the situation. I admit to being an optimist. That said, I don’t understand how you can have such vitriol for so may sports figures (t-wolves leadership, Punto, Bill Smith, Gardenhire, Childress, etc.). Finally, I tire of your use of Jesus in ways that don’t glorify Him, especially on Easter which many of us are celebrating today.There are many ways to make examples and demonstrate points without using His name so nonchalantly while you are also using emotionally charged name-calling in the same post/paragraph.
I respect your sensibilities Werbelink, and I am sorry I offended you. I can’t say that I won’t change my ways, or my use of the words however. It’s just part of who I am, and how I am… It took 30 years to get use to not being like everyone else, I’m finally starting to enjoy it… I’d hate to change it now.
More importantly however… I followed the NBA since Magic Johnson and Bird, and before Jordan, and ESPN ruined the game (though it’s not Jordan’s fault). I’ve been a Steeler’s fan for 30 plus years so ripping the vikings is about as easy as breathing. And no offense but Baseball is my religion. My belief in GOD is one thing, but by the definition of spending my time thinking about, praying about and working around things… baseball defines me far more than organized religion… so I’m kind of geeky and pay attention to the minor leaguers, major leaguers, history, and everything I can find baseball related. To find me happy, you will find me at a sporting event with my children either playing, or watching with me where I can point out the things that someone did right or wrong to teach them to see the game with a 3D feel and not just see something for the sake of seeing it, but to truly experience it. You know… pointing out like Cuddyer did to Delmon Young… “you have to kill that second baseman with your slide.” In reference to breaking up a double play. Those kinds of things make me happy. Listening to Frank Sinatra makes me happy. Watching Spinal Tap makes me laugh… However Baseball isn’t just a game to me. Right or wrong it is my way of life, and when I see terrible things like Nick Punto or Denard Span with a bat in their hand I want someone punished for it because it lowers the quality of the game… even a preseason game.
Werbelink… don’t go into the Timberwolves blog here on the strib… I say that out of respect for you because you are a nice guy, and in there… I will never hold anything back… they get my venom 100% with every breath I breathe. I only bring them up here to make a point…
It’s very hard to be positive in this world in general, and as a sports fan with the way that they are run… I rarely go after the players except for Punto and Span… I almost always stick with the people making the decisions. You can’t blame a soldier for the war… the leaders put them there, and gave them the equipment, and the battle plan, and sports are the same way. But I didn’t try to offend you at all, and no I’m not getting political, or trying to upset others… I’m making an analogy.
If baseball is your religion, then you should study the Good Book more diligently and not misquote the DH rule as handed down from the COMMISSIONER!!! (all stand please)
BC, as a kid growing up watching the Twins in the 60’s, I used to go off on rants about players who I thought were lousy and I would wish out loud for the Twins to get rid of them (Bernie Allen was one I used to go off on). My Dad would remind me that any player who could make it to the Major League level was one heckuva player. Even though MLB has grown since the 60’s, only the best players still make to that level. That said, I think it’s an exaggeration to call Punto or Span a “terrible thing..with a bat in their hand”. I disagree that they lower the quality of the game. If they were not or are not good enough, they’ll not last in the majors. Lastly, I have seen you write many times that baseball is your religion. Christianity is my religion, and sports are one of my hobbies, or dare I say past times(as in America’s favorite…)? For me God has to be first in my life, with my family, friends, job and hobbies coming next. It’s the order and perspective that works best for me…tried and true. God doesn’t disappoint, but baseball and sports certainly will from time to time. As you would say, “that’s who I am, and how I am”. Thanks BC, I’ll get off my soap box now and stick to baseball in future posts.
werbellik
I’m not worried, I don’t mind chatting about other things… I am just not allowed to get political without listening to 4-5 people get bent out of shape.
I didn’t say that I didn’t put GOD first… I’m saying I put baseball over organized religion. A strange comment I’m sure, but it’s hard to make a complicated point in a blog, lol.
So by no means do I hold an animosity towards God or Jesus, Buddha, or Allah for that matter… it’s always been the people that tell me how I’m supposed to interpret, and believe… they get my venom… like Kevin McHale, lol.
Seriously though. I am going to post something that is a bit more positive than it might sound. And I want it to be that way because as I said, I want to be wrong sometimes… I don’t want to be perfect, and I fail at that all the time… just look at my spelling for the love of all things holy… perfection is lucky that it’s spelled correctly.
Denard Span has impressed me in how he’s working counts. He has impressed me more this spring than any other player on the team bar none. I will admit that I think he’s worse than Punto as a ball player, and coming from that perspective he has almost nowhere to go but up, but he has shown me to be more of a prospect than I would have ever given him credit for without getting to see the highlights and some of my buddies that live in that area have been keeping me abreast of a lot of things twins related. That being said, he’s still at least 2 years away from being a 5th outfielder… a defensive replacement. His swing is still below average, his baserunning in springtraining is not something I’ve seen enough to see if it’s athletic ability or smarts, but I will give him the benefit of the doubt that he’s not as stupid on the bases as his career steal percentage would show… But I think it would be a horrible mistake for the Twins to put him in CF ahead of Gomez. There is no logical reason to do that because I’m not convinced that Span has much of a ceiling left, and that he still very well maybe over-achieving to get to where he is in spring training, and that Gomez could very well be 10 times better than I ever would have given him credit for (as I’m still bitter about Ellsbury).
Punto however is overrated as a fielder in my opinion because he still makes a lot of errors, and bad judgements… he can make the ESPN highlight play as well if not better than anyone, but he struggles with throws, and makes tough throws out of routine plays by not setting himself at times which as long as he’s been in baseball is meaning he’s still far too instinctual and not using his brain enough… so as a back up infielder I’m ok with him in a Jeff Reboulet/Denny Hocking/Al Newman role. Beyond that last year I believe until his last 57 atbats he was clocking in with the 4th worst batting average of the last 70 years, and with how he’s looked this spring… he’d need a miracle just to be a .250 hitter. With no pop, and not much in the way of base stealing savy… that’s not exactly what I’d call a major leaguer. I think that the Twins might actually be better going with Tolbert and Buscher as the two infield backups because Tolbert still has potential to get better. Punto I don’t think can.
And finally, back to the religion thing… I’ve never gotten teary eyed walking into a church. However I did walking into Wrigley Field. Heck I did walking into Kaufman stadium, and New Busch as well… Though I did feel a panic attack in a beautiful catholic church in downtown New Orleans once… I actually felt terrified. Maybe that was God getting me back for my comments about Dwight Gooden’s curveball being so good that not even God could hit it, but that’s another story…
a bit serious are we, twins will be alright. what i would say is that once this team gels in a year or two, mr pohlad and his family best not let any and i mean any player go that will help the twins remain contenders for years. if he has to break the bank to do it he had better in future seasons or he and his family will be run out of town one way or another. now that is serious
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