Liriano lasts just four innings for Rochester
Posted on April 8th, 2008 – 7:45 PMBy Joe Christensen
Francisco Liriano needed 88 pitches to get through four innings tonight for Class AAA Rochester, and Casey Daigle has replaced him to start the fifth inning in Norfolk, Va.
Liriano gave up three runs on five hits, with three walks and three strikeouts. It remains unclear if that was enough to convince the Twins he is ready to rejoin the major league rotation. A spot could be open Sunday if Kevin Slowey is unable to make the start.
Rochester shortstop Alexi Casilla made two errors while Liriano was in the game, forcing the lefthander to use several extra pitches.
71 Responses to "Liriano lasts just four innings for Rochester"
Seems like the two Casilla errors didn’t help too much. The play-by-play doesn’t look too bad, bring him up!
Here’s hoping Casilla, Punto and Gardenhire all get run over by oncoming traffic.
huh, errors don’t help Liriano’s line, I was hoping for a better outing overall than that, but 88 pitches is about the same pitch count all the Twins starters have been on so far, and how much more can be done for him in the minors? bring him back and generate some more excitement for these guys, I know I’ll be at the first game he starts this year in the Dome…
The only problem is that his 88 pitches lasted him only 4 innings… If Slowey cannot make it on Sunday, Mulvey might be the best option out of Rochester based on record
3 walks in 4 innings. He’s still finding himself.
I wonder if he’s letting loose the whole time, if he fatigues, what the strikes/balls ratio was, what pitches he was missing with, and how close to the plate were the balls and the walks (bad ump?).
I’m guessing Gardy will use it as a reason to keep him down one more start. i think Gardy is trying to buy time to figure out who goes down.
It’s in the upper 40’s & misting. The “Franchise” just couldn’t get loose! He just doesn’t have what he had in 2006! All of you “kool-aid” drinkers just have to take another big gulp! Remember what I said from spring training! It’s going to be a long season!
garza injured
left the 3rd inning with radial nerve irritation
more news after the game
i read that it could be several days in a splint without playing and last resort is surgery.. surgery though is not very successful which is why its last resort..
i have the link on what i believe the injury is.. click on my name
the treatment is close to the bottom of the page
Was in the ballpark at Norfolk tonight. Gotta tell ya - one of the coldest games I’ve been at outside of the Midwest. 49 and plunging at game time, with a steady mist and nasty 10-15 mph wind. Franchise looked sharp as a tack in the first, and was doing fine in the second (one scratch walk) until Casilla’s first error (he lost the handle on a sure DP grounder; Casilla’s second error was right through the wickets, Little League style. Ouch).
Liriano was a lot shakier in the third and fourth, tho - way too many first pitch balls (he was *pounding* the strike zone earlier). He battled, but it wasn’t pretty.
How bad was the weather? Three-quarters of the home team’s infield wore ski masks. That makes me want to write this one off. But I’d say a Sunday start against the Landed Gentry isn’t the sure thing Gardy might want it to be.
two errors
it made him throw some extra pitches
boof is struggling throwing strikes
slowey might be injured
liriano threw 86 pitches
its tripple a
not as good defense
what the heck
give the guy a chance
Bring him up….Livan sucked in ST too….this guy isn’t a AAA pitcher, get him up here.
thanks for the notes, tgd….bring him up already….
wow if the weather was that bad then bring him up
the weather hasnt been that bad at all
it shouldnt be that bad if he makes a sunday day game in kc
To Romer: He was plenty loose in pre-game, and the fastball had serious pop (he loosened up on the outfield grass in front of us before his pregame bullpen warmup).
What I *didn’t* see was a lot of control on the breaking stuff. We were far enough down the third-base line that I couldn’t get a great angle, but he didn’t have the devastating slider from ‘05.
Then again, as cold as it was, I half expected to see his arm just break off and land halfway to the plate. So we’ll count our blessings on *that*.
everyone worried about liriano but not about garza…
Great report, tgd. On behalf of everyone….
THANK YOU.
The baseball gods are holding him back. The timing of everything this Spring seems to work against him. I don’t see the cautious Twins as pulling the trigger yet. Can’t blame ‘em.
So…….actually, the bad news is about Casilla. A real downer.
casilla needs to get his head on straight. and liondragon? why would we be worried about garza? last time i checked he doesnt play for us.
It’s cold, windy, and rainy here in the Norfolk area.
He shouldn’t have been here to begin with… Bring him up and pitch him on Sunday!
But it’s interesting, lots of us were looking forward to Garza, Santana, and Liriano as being 3 Twins aces this year.
I think Casilla might have some ADHD.
Frankie will be shining shoes at the airport in two years, book it.
Why is the best pitcher in our organization pitching if the weather is that bad? Seems like an unnecessary risk. Bring him up and have him do long relief if hes not quite ready (although I think he is ready and should start). At least then he won’t go out there half frozen.
“We were far enough down the third-base line that I couldn’t get a great angle, but he didn’t have the devastating slider from ‘05.”
That’s the problem —– he’s changed his slider, and doesn’t have good control over it. When he does, it’s a good pitch….a fast slurve.
So where should he develop and progress that pitch? Has to be in MLB, where Anderson can keep an eye on things.
So if he’s in playing shape, and has no arm problems, I’m having second thoughts and maybe they should call him up and start the process…..if he’s listening and staying within himself and not overthrowing.
But they don’t want him to fail in the bigs, and then have to send him down again.
Tough decision.
I want and hope that Franchise rejoins the big league club this week. A couple reasons…
#1 I don’t want him pitching in these conditions
#2 He showed at the end of Spring Traning that if he is motivated he can bring more.
#3 I remember reading how Anderson and Gardy said that Cisco is a game pitcher. He needs the atmosphere to get him to pitch his best. He is horrible in practice and I imagine after pitching in the bigs AAA isn’t very motivating. Especially in crap conditions.
#4 Anderson is our best and I want him working with Cisco
#5 I still have hopes in this club. The pitching has been pretty good except for Slowey adn I think this lineup can hit. This team can compete.
#6 I have Cisco on my fantasy bench and am hoping with a few starts he can start on my team. 
LOL
Who’s the idiot that let him pitch with the temps in the 40’s? Why not let him pitch in Fort Meyers tonight? For stupid…
agreed, cronn….a 40 degree start doesn’t do anyone any good….just get him up here already and quit playing with his head…
Jason, Was this Gardy or Bill Smith’s idea?
Call him up and give him the start Sunday like they’ve been talking about.
He may stuggle, but he wouldn’t be the only Twins pitcher this season to do that.
Bill Smith is responsible for who makes the roster. Gardy has input, but it isn’t his call.
Cronn, before you start calling people idiots, did you realize that IF Liriano is brought up to pitch on Sunday he will be in Kansas City. Not exactly the tropics. In fact, the forecast for Kansas City on Sunday is the low 50’s. Saturday is mid 40’s with snow. What if that weather system stalls for a day? Don’t you think the Twins would like to know that he can handle pitching in colder weather before deciding what to do for Sunday? If he’s not ready to pitch under any conditions without risking his health, he’s not ready to be called up.
I was at the game, and it wasn’t THAT cold. Upper 40s, light mist, didn’t notice the wind. Maybe it’s because I’m from Minnesota, but it was kind of embarassing to see some of the guys wearing face masks. That said, I hope the weather was Liriano’s problem tonight.
That’s why Casilla is in AAA. The Twins really want him to be there SS/2B but he’s not mentally into it yet.
Toby Gardenhire is leading the Fort Myers Miracle in hitting with a .625 BA.
His mother must have taught him to hit.
Mom, please don’t let your husband and Vavra screw this up. Hide the kid!!!
Why is the weather suddenly a factor? You don’t think Liriano’s ever going to have to pitch in less than perfect situations?
And yeah, maybe he has a tough time in cold, or rain, or snow, or tornadoes….but doesn’t every player?
We wouldn’t even be talking about weather if this was some other Twins pitcher. Most likely half of us here would’ve already dismissed the pitcher as washed up and would have already suggested trading him for some mythical 3B or DH that’s available.
On a side note, Detroit slides to 0-7. Anybody think they’ll make it to 0-10? Or will they win one by then?
Also, Royals knock off the Jeterless Yankees and go 5-2. First Detroit (who at the time was supposed to be a powerhouse) and now one from the Yankees. Those two wins Friday and Saturday are starting to look might impressive. 
I think it is pretty obvious from all reports that Liriano doesn’t have his control back yet. He is still working on his new mechanics and trying to figure a few things out. I think you leave him down in the minors for another start or two until he can prove that he has control of all his pitches. As stated above you don’t want to bring him up, have him struggle for a couple of outings and then have to send him back down. This team isn’t going anywhere this season anyway so why not wait until he is fully ready to go before calling him up?
In just two years, there will be lots of potential for 40° games here in Minnesota. If he is going to pitch here he needs to demonstrate he can take the range of conditions.
Smith does not make roster decisions like a Czar, no doubt and especially in his situation, it is done by committee.
Gardy does not have access to watching minor league players every day so how could he make the final decision?
Liriano just doesn’t have his command. I am sure it is because he has had to alter his delivery. He will need time to work on it if we want him to be dominant like he once was. By all reports though, he will never have that slider again, which was what made him great.
As of right now, our starters have been as good as anyone in the league. That is not the Twins problem in the least - right now.
What good is it going to do to bring him up when he is not ready and have him take his lickings in front of all of MLB? People will be questioning his worth to the team, saying he is finished, etc, etc. I can see it right now on baseball tonight breaking down Cisco and how he will never be what he was.
I say let him get back to form before bringing him back. I myself do not want to see a Liriano of the 4IP, 3ER, 4BB ilk.
cheap skate Pohlad was hoping to get away with his cheap move of letting Johan go thinking Liriano was waiting in the wings.
Of course, if Liriano was too good, he wouldnt be here long either
this after Pohlad bilks the taxpayers out of 300 plus million for his own business purpose
I wonder if Liriano didn’t change his slider grip. Changing from a Carlton slider to a conventional one would make it a totally different pitch, more slurve like. It seems some guys who throw that Carlton slider have had some elbow issues, like John Smoltz.
update on garza,
15 day disabled list and may be longer.. they do not know for sure how long it will be but atleast 15
Liriano may have to eliminate the Slider because he throws it unnaturally and it is causing arm issues
Also what do you think we would have to give up for Adam Dunn or Prince Fielder
maybe a Kubel/Cuddy/Everett package
when are they gonna make a decision!? does anyone know?
Dunn would be much less than Fielder
Also what do you think we would have to give up for Adam Dunn or Prince Fielder
Prying Fielder away from the Brewers would be like trying to gte Reyes or Wright from the Mets…
maybe a Kubel/Cuddy/Everett package
And with that package, you wouldn’t get past “How about Fie-” before they hung up.
this after Pohlad bilks the taxpayers out of 300 plus million for his own business purpose
And then signs Morneau, Cuddyer, and Nathan to multiyear extended contracts.
JUST LIKE PEOPLE WANTED HIM TOO!
But good to see your right back in form Kevin. I was worried for a second you’d actually gotten over yourself.
15 day disabled list and may be longer.. they do not know for sure how long it will be but atleast 15
That sucks, I was eyeing the schedules to see if he’d lineup for a start here at the Dome in a few weeks. That would’ve been a fun game to go to. (I’d give a warm welcome to both he and Bartlett when they took the field)
I think Tampa is going to be a nice club soon. They have some good hitters in the lineup. Good power in the Lineup. Some speed. They are putting together a nice you rotation. They also are in fierce competition with the Yankees
Gardy does not have access to watching minor league players every day so how could he make the final decision?
I’m guessing Gardy (much like Smith) knows the kinds of things the main club needs. While minor league coaches are the ones who’ll keep a close eye on the progress of various players the org is looking to bring up.
So a lot of Smith and Gardy’s decisions about the big league roster is based on trusting your minor league staff to provide accurate reports of progress. Because you’re exactly right, neither Smith nor Gardy is able to watch the progress of four (five?) team’s worth of minor league talent.
I know it’s a little soon to talk trades but the Brewers are looking for a closers since Gagne has had problems, how about sending Nathan and Monroe to the Brewers for Cory Hart,AAA ss Ozzie Chavez and A 3b Tayler Green and maybe 1 other mid level player. I do not think the Twins need a closer of Nathans value for this year and closers seem to be easier to find than other pitchers. Harts bat could be a big help based on last season and with Cuddyers injury.
Casilla needs to get it together. Maybe he just isnt that good.
How about Nathan and Cuddy for Prince Fielder
“T” would I make it one letter closer before they hung up the phone on me
How about Fiel (Click)
[…] other notes Joe Christensen reported on Francisco Liriano’s shaky start for Rochester yesterday. Liriano threw 88 pitches in four innings and gave up three runs with 6 […]
How about Nathan and Cuddy for Prince Fielder
Cuddy’s on the DL, he can’t be traded. And I’m guessing teams would be reluctant to take him straight off of it.
It’s 8 games into the season. Way too early to start talking about trading two guys they just extended.
Especially when it’s two guys they extended to have a core to build around.
After a second major injury to Liriano’s arm followed by surgery. Who knows if he will still be the same pitcher. Some players never come back with the same stuff. I know one thing though he should eliminate his slider from his pitch selection or learn how to throw the pitch from a different angle. This pitch I feel is causing damage to his arm
cuddy and nathan both have no trade clauses i believe…. so…..
Don’t know about Cuddy, but Nathan can only specify three teams he won’t go to.
I always though Liriano would be another Scott Erickson, untouchable before arm problems, above average after
so far, it looks like we would be lucky to have this
LIONDRAGON Why did we do another no trade clause on more contracts didn’t we learn from our (santana) mistakes. Doing the same thing and expecting a different reaction each time shows a sense of insanity
Why did we do another no trade clause on more contracts didn’t we learn from our (santana) mistakes.
It’s a limited NTC. 3-teams. That’s a big difference from Santana and his full NTC.
Cuddyer does not have a no-trade clause. Nathan has a limited no-trade clause, which allows him to exclude three teams from trade options. That leaves 27 teams he can be traded to without waiving the clause, which is 27 more than Santana had in his contract.
First off the Brewers are not going to trade Prince Fielder. Secondly, the Twins are not going to trade Cuddyer. Thirdly, if the Twins trade Joe Nathan they need to get back a stud SS, 2B, or 3B. Teams aren’t real willing to give those guys up. I agree that the Brewers and Nathan look like a good match but I don’t think the Twins will trade him this season. If the Twins are still struggling next year they might trade him before next years trade deadline.
Actually it only leave Nathan 26 teams to get traded to. He isn’t going to be traded to the Twins either.
I dont think the Twins are going to trade any player that they just extended.
I do not see us trading anyone outside of pitching prospects…
ESPN’s website has Brian Bass slated as the starter on Sunday vs. KC.
Any truth to this or just some intern over there speculating?
I think we should bring up Humber and Mulvey soon and see what they can do with Slowey being injured and having a huge ERA
Man….I’ve been to 2 games already (Game 2 vs. Angels and Game 3 vs. KC) at the Dome and I’m going next Wednesday vs. TB and Boof is the starter in all 3 (likely).
ARRRGGGHHHHHH
Oh yeah and we should see if Bass can settle down or send Bass and Slowey down and bring up Humber and Mulvey
Bill Brasky Man….I’ve been to 2 games already (Game 2 vs. Angels and Game 3 vs. KC) at the Dome and I’m going next Wednesday vs. TB and Boof is the starter in all 3 (likely).
ARRRGGGHHHHHH
I feel very sorry for you Billiam. Now my question for you is why does Boof Light put his head facing down and roll his eyes real far back. One suggestion is By the tickets the day of the game and use a happenings book coupon for buy one get one free tickets
Sending Bass down would mean that the Twins will loose him. There are teams already that are looking for bullpen help and he is out of options.
jimmy- I feel your pain.. been to a couple Boof games myself.
Gross.
I loved watching Radke live because the game would be over in 2 1/2 hours. He worked fast and threw strikes.
RyanW Great point and what should we do if he continues to struggle. Maybe Package him and trade him
