Baker placed on DL; Liriano to start Opening Night
Posted on April 2nd, 2009 – 8:49 AMBy Joe Christensen
FORT MYERS, FLA. — The Twins placed projected Opening Night starter Scott Baker on the 15-day disabled list this morning with right shoulder stiffness.
Francisco Liriano will start Monday’s opener against Seattle, with Nick Blackburn, Kevin Slowey and Glen Perkins following the next three games. There is word R.A. Dickey likely will start April 10 at Chicago, as the team’s No. 5 starter.
Baker, who signed a four-year, $15.25 million contract last month, threw only 58 pitches on Wednesday in a start against Class AAA Norfolk, tossing five scoreless innings.
The Twins also placed Joe Mauer (inflammation right sacroiliac joint) and Boof Bonser (rotator cuff surgery) on the 15-day disabled list today. Those were expected moves.
With Baker and Bonser on the DL, the Twins are down to 12 pitchers, with Brian Duensing and Philip Humber likely making the team as relievers.
The 12 pitchers: Liriano, Blackburn, Slowey, Perkins, Dickey, Joe Nathan, Matt Guerrier, Jesse Crain, Luis Ayala, Craig Breslow, Humber and Duensing.
Baker, who went 1-2 with a 6.85 ERA in six spring training starts, last pitched in a Grapefruit League game on March 27, so he’s eligible to return from the 15-day DL on April 12.
Update: Justin Morneau said he tweaked something in the middle of his back with a swing during batting practice Tuesday, and it’s been stiff the past two days.
“It’s nothing I’m too concerned about,” he said. “Just don’t want it to be something that nags on when the season starts. … If this was Game No. 1 or Game No. 100, I’m sure I’d be out there.”
Morneau said he hopes to play in a minor-league game Friday or in the Twins’ final Grapefruit League game Saturday against Pittsburgh. That way, “it’s not a bunch of days off in a row,” Morneau said. “So we’ll see what happens.”
Regarding Baker, Morneau said, “It’s disappointing, but I talked to him, and he said they were just pushing him back [one start].”
Update: Baker said he has stiffness in the back of his shoulder. He felt more sore than usual after his start last Friday against Tampa Bay. Then, in his start Wednesday against Class AAA Norfolk, it became increasingly tough to get loose between innings.
There was no talk about putting him on the DL, however, until today, he said.
“It stinks,” he said. “The timing’s just not great. I would love to throw Opening Day, but that’s not the best thing for the team. And I could have done it. There’s no doubt in my mind. I kind of let them know that I can definitely pitch. Obvioiusly nobody can guarrantee that it’s going to get better, if I continue to pitch. It possibly could stay the same or get worse.”
Asked if he will miss just one start, Baker said, “I think so.” But he also said he will not be throwing until at least Saturday, when he’ll be re-evaluated.
“We haven’t got an exact timetable yet — what we’re shooting for, when I would start with the club — but hopefully I’ll just miss that one start,” he said.
Update: Obviously, the Twins decided to cut short Liriano’s outing today since he’ll be pitching the opener on three day’s rest. Liriano held the Red Sox to one run on three hits, with one walk and three strikeouts.
Update: Matt Tolbert replaced shortstop Nick Punto for the top of the fifth inning. Punto had gotten up slowly after lunging for a popup in left field by Mike Lowell in the fourth inning. Punto did start a 6-4-3 double play to end the Boston fourth, but I’ll check to see if he’s OK postgame. Otherwise, add him to the list.
315 Responses to "Baker placed on DL; Liriano to start Opening Night"
ugh… is morneau next?
didn’t see that coming
not good
I thought this was an April Fools Day posting, but then I looked at the date.
at least they can keep Humber, right?
geez, here we go…
poop!
does this mean they twins will break camp with 11 pitchers and delay their decision between tolber/harris/buscher until Baker comes back?
Looks like it will be Dickey AND Duensing coming north…
poor Baker. I know he was getting geared up for this start.
I am not a huge fan of it being Dickey to start though. He is hands down a much better reliever than starter (even though he’s shown a few good starts this spring, he’s only gone 4 innings; I’d venture to guess he might get knocked around by the 5th inning). I’d rather it be Humber and have Dickey relieve him if he doesn’t make it that far.
didn’t see the update when i posted that, but would u really rather have Duensing than Harris/Buscher/Tolbert?
Hope Baker’s soreness is not like Bonser’s soreness
Bad break with Baker, but I’ve been rooting for Dickey to make the team all along. Liriano vs. Hernandez should make for a great opening night matchup.
Yikes
I think it would be wise to bring 12 pitchers up…Without Baker, we’ll need all the arms we can get.
Hope Baker’s issue doesn’t turn into Joe Mays syndrome.
I am having flashbacks to the Joe Mays deal now. I’m with Aaron I hope this is nothing more then just soreness.
Duensing/Humber make it a larger bullpen, Dickey starter… that makes a 12 man staff..
Tolbert to AAA until the Twins foolisly trade/cut Harris..
big dick will only get one start, bake will be back in a week. this is just precautionary; twins figure he cant start opening day so just put him on dl now and have him come back for what would have been his 3rd start.
did that come out of nowhere? Where there any physical concerns about his disappointing outings?
There’s no good time for Baker to be on the DL, but better now than mid-season.
I wondered why Baker only threw 58 pitches. So, as Smith told Mijares, there’s always injuries by April 15th, be ready, the injuries pop up already. Now only to trade Harris and things will be set.
Aaron, it’s stiffness, not soreness.
In hindsight - Baker put together a string of less than stellar outings - should have asked more critical questions - wonder when this started……
I hate everything!@
Damn it who was it that said right after the Baker contract signing that he was going to be the next Joe Mays? WHO JINXED OUR SEASON?
Do the Twins have a medical staff to speak of?? Just curious.
I would highly doubt this is a lingering stiffness, but something that just came up yesterday. It seems very convient that it comes now, making a tough decision a no brainer. It just delays a tough decision. Could be Scott’s just taking the bullet for the team.
The one guy we want to throw more innings than any other guy on the team is starting the season with a sore shoulder……reminds me of Radke’s final season but at least we had Johan then.
Duensing/Humber/Dickey for two spots - me feeling duked. Having tore my rotator cuff, you can feel it coming in the shoulder - was it Baker who didn’t mention it, or was it a super secret team deal - I want to know where the leaks were?
‘Could be Scott’s just taking the bullet for the team.’ Buchser/Humber take bullets, Opening Day, newly inked starters shouldn’t –
If this isn’t just a passing stiffy then the Twins will be sitting on 3 bad contracts! ALL OF THEM “GARDY’S GUYS”
Just means that the other guys will have to step it up a little bit till Baker comes back. Lets just hope its for 2 weeks and not more…
No Mauer, no Baker. Twins are in bad shape already.
Just another conspiracy for the Twins… right?? 
At least they’ll have a nice built-in excuse if they’re 10 games out by the all-star break.
Just something for folks to get worked up about for a few days.
We’ll be fine. This team really looks decent. I just wish I’d of stayed down there another week. It’s a might chilly up here.
Don’t they have to put Bonser on the 60-Day DL so they can make room for Dickey on the 40-man Roster?
NOOOOOOoooooooo………..
[…] MarkW alerted me to this in the comments, and Joe C confirms: Baker is headed to the DL and won’t make his Opening Day […]
I must admit I was wondering why he only threw 58 pitches the other day. That should have been a red flag to us at this point as he is stretched out pretty good for the opener.
AGHHHHHHHHH this is bad news. We need Bake in the rotation.
At least we won’t have to hear shazel bitching about Liriano no starting Opening Day anymore.
I guess we’ll have to wait for 2010 for Baker to pitch a full season in the Majors.
“It seems very convient that it comes now, making a tough decision a no brainer..Could be Scott’s just taking the bullet for the team.”
“was it Baker who didn’t mention it, or was it a super secret team deal - I want to know where the leaks were?”
Twisted minds need to know!!!!!
I hope this won’t lead to season-long complaints about the length of spring training screwing up the pitchers.
Remember how the last WBC messed up Silva for an entire season?
Hey Trish, how goes it?
This makes my boy Blackburn the #3 starter on this team. what do you all say to THAT?
“At least we won’t have to hear shazel bitching about Liriano no starting Opening Day anymore.”
He’s already on to another topic, WJ.
That darned Gardy.
It’s just the tip of the iceberg.
The rumor is that the whole team has been kidnapped by terrorists who are demanding that 3 million season tickets be sold by Opening Day.
I think the Twins Front Office is behind it.
I don’t remember who it was that made the comment about this making a tough decision easier. If Baker were completely healthy, there’s no way they’d DL their ace just to make deciding on the long reliever easier. However, I suppose it’s possible they see a silver lining with being cautious. That is, did anyone else read between the lines when Dickey said something to the effect of hoping the Twins would be “honest” and bring up the player who did best in spring training? Now they don’t have to choose between letting Humber go for nothing or pissing off Dickey.
It’s all pretty conspirational, I know. Just sayin’…
Heal soon, Baker. And Mauer. *Gulp*
haha good one sane.
Hi Matt… I still wish that Baker wasn’t out. Would make life a lot better.
MSM
I think this makes Blackburn #4. Remember Gardy’s love for LRLR. Franchise, Slowey, Perk, Blackie
It could be worse there could be a guy named Ponson or Hernandez starting opening day.
Sign Pedro. What did JimCrikket say? There’s going to be time you need more SP? I’d rather have Pedro than Perkins, and I’d DEFINITELY rather have Pedro than Dickey.
As for the protracted TolbertHarrisBuscher debate…I’m just glad Casilla played well when called up last year after playing poorly in the minors…or else Casilla might be included in this debate. Thankfully, he’s locked into our middle infield as a starter.
Nope Aaron… it has been said that it will be Blackburn. From Kelly Thesier’s Blog:
“Nick Blackburn Kevin Slowey, and Glen Perkins in the next three games vs. Seattle.” (after Lirano)
trish
Thanks, I dont get around to reading articles from the MLB site much. I stand corrected.
Things like the Baker prob will continue to happen until the Strib fixes its blog clocks.
Howard Sinker, is there anyone unstupid enough at the Strib to fix things up?!
Some blogs are correct Romer… just these are the ones that don’t like to change.
I’m with romer. I vow to blame the clocks and the Star for every setback the Twins have. I will do this until the clocks are fixed.
What’s worse is that this screws up Liriano’s prep for the season. And he wasn’t exactly totally ready.
So, does he pitch at all today?
trish
But we all know that these are the only blogs that matter.
Well of course Aaron. I am 100% with you on that one!
Doesn’t anybody, including Gardy, have any fun anymore.
Why not just start Dickey Monday? Keeping the business politics straight, it would be quite an exhibition for the near-capacity crowd. And he’s definitely hot right now.
And it wouldn’t screw up the rest of the starting staff at this tender time.
So, GARDY and BILLY:
Can you guys think on your feet?
Yes, Liriano pitches today
“Howard Sinker, is there anyone unstupid enough at the Strib to fix things up?!”
Howard’s blog has the correct time.
Yes, this is not good. But those who count the Twins out always end up eating their words. We will be fine. This team has more depth than any since the Twins began their run in ‘02. Dickey will fill in nicely, and we’ll see what Humber can do.
I have to admit I’m quite surprised. I thought nothing of him pitching just 5 innings yesterday or throwing just 58 pitches. I figured that was a predetermined number to give him work and be ready for Opening Night.
Definitely did not see this coming. and I HOPE this isn’t some sort of conspiracy to keep all three pitchers or all 3 infielders. You wouldln’t DL your top pitcher just to keep a 24th or 25th man on the roster.
On another note, I really like this part of the lineup today:
Cuddyer 1B (with Morneau out; no Buscher) and Harris DH. It might say something about who might have lost that last position battle…
“Howard’s blog has the correct time.”
Howard’s in charge of all this blog stuff at the Strib, isn’t he?
Wouldn’t it be nice if the Twins could have just one season where a key piece of the team doesn’t start the season on the DL.
Oh well, I know [i]one[/i] guy who’s going to be happy that Liriano’s in.
“Yes, Liriano pitches today”
Yes, I suppose. So now he starts the opener on 3 days’ rest, iron arm and all.
Not buying the Baker conspiracy story, albeit, crossed my mind on Buscher (chest) - wouldn’t have surprised to have full physicals on all three looking for a questionable mole. I am frustrated no-one else even questioned the ST performance to this point of ‘could there be an injury.’ What me sayin’ - maybe I missed it.
“On another note, I really like this part of the lineup today:”
What do mean “another” note? Now we’re talking Morneau’s bad back.
Lucky it’s only Seattle….
If Baker’s pitching issues were caused by a physical ailment it is better to get him some rest than having him have 2-3 awful starts in games that matter. This way the Twins have a chance to evaluate Humber, Dickey and Duensing for 2 more weeks facing real competition. It would be interesting who would take Baker’s place in the rotation (I suspect Humber), because Dickey is probably more valuable in the pen (since he can go long multiple days in a row) and Humber has been more successful as a starter than a reliever (the opposite of Dickey)
Move has to be made to add RA Dickey to 40 man. Of course, simply move Boof to 60 day DL.
I am Topp Dogg……Licking my chops.
I knew something was brewing when Joe C posted a new blog last night and no one responded for an hour and a half.
We’re all asleep at the switch, people!!!
romer
After last year…you are forbidden to say “it’s only Seattle.”
What do mean “another” note?
the fact that for the first time in more than a year, Cuddyer is on 1st base instead of Buscher. If Cuddyer can be counted to back up 1st, Buscher is less needed.
Hey…they just fixed the times!!!!
Huh?
Boof will have to be put on the 60-day DL eventually to make space. I wonder why the Twins haven’t done it yet?
They could be trying to swing a last-minute deal for Harris and/or Humber.
how could they put anyone on the dl without consulting the medical experts on this blog before hand?
Still think it’s a brainless decision to move the starters up one day.
So everyone starts with 3 days’ rest opening week?
Great planning…….
simply move Boof to 60 day DL.
Boof was moved to the 15-day DL.
That does not open his spot on the 40-man roster. They can move him to the 60 day, but they might open a spot through a trade.
“They could be trying to swing a last-minute deal for Harris and/or Humber.”
NOT!!!
Humber now is solid gold. Not only could he start for 5 MLB teams (Hi shazel) he now can start for 6 MLB teams!
And as soon as you trade Harris, Tolbert and Crede come down with injuries. Right?
Is it okay to drink in the morning? Gonna go to the bar this morning, trish?
romer, it’s only okay to drink in the morning if you didn’t sleep at all last night.
If Dickey is going to be a starter the first time through the rotation I would put him 4th in the rotation. That way we don’t have to start our year against Chicago with our weakest starter and our knuckler will have the luxury of pitching in the 70 degree Dome rather than 40 degree Cell.
With Glaus’ rehab taking a couple of bad turns, and the apparent sighting of Cardinal’s scouts in recent Twins’ game, there has been some speculation that a trade might be discussed. Harris was mentioned as an option, but Buscher would probably fit the bill a bit better…
Is it too early to beg for the GameDay link? Because I suppose the Twins Radio Network will de-network again and I won’t get the broadcast down here again.
But……..thanks for fixing the clock! We’re on our way!!!!!!!!!!
knuckler will have the luxury of pitching in the 70 degree Dome rather than 40 degree Cell.
A knuckler would love to pitch in 40 degree (and wet hopefully) weather. That ball would be heavier and have the spin of a canteloupe in those conditions (that’s a good thing)
“and our knuckler will have the luxury of pitching in the 70 degree Dome rather than 40 degree Cell.”
Thank you, triple-dot. At least SOMEone is thinking SOMEwhere.
Thanks for your decent diversion, thrylos. But I thought knucklers don’t like adverse weather conditions….at least, especially, a lot of wind.
Wow… our complaining about the times finally paid off!
That may give some of us the idea that someone IS actually listening to what we say.
“Is it okay to drink in the morning?”
romer, it’s evident that you’re asking for permission after the fact.
Just kidding you.
romer,
wind can be somewhat of a problem, I suppose, but last season Dickey had a 4.48 ERA in open stadiums (72.1 IP) and 6.53 ERA in domes (40 IP), which indicated that it was ok for him.
Romer,
It’s 5 o’clock somewhere…
“romer, it’s evident that you’re asking for permission after the fact.”
Would that it were so!
and no bar for me today… i’m in circuits and electronics lab as we speak till 1, then history of math class at 2.
“history of math”? No typo?
Show ‘em the new defensive stats Bible. Current events are party of history…….
part of history………
Where’s my drink?
or party of history……..
That’s better.
“History of math class”? Have they covered the era where nuns used to smack you on the knuckles with a ruler if you didn’t finish the multiplication tables?
no typo romer… the class sucks.
Knuckles in ole ChiTown….LOL
Where does the history of math begin? Is there a picture of two cavemen gathering berries or deciding how many Mamoths they need to hunt?
History of Math
Chapter 1: The Rise of the Integers
Chapter 2: Great Moments in Counting: “Six-Finger” Thag Breaks the Ten Barrier
Chapter 3: Nick Punto Records Lowest BA in 35 Years for a Full-Time Player
Sounds like a class that people who hate math take to get a math credit.
Gen Ed Class?
1-2-3 inning with 8 total pitches for Liriano
Ha! The Rise of the Integers…..that’s a band, isn’t it?
That ball would be heavier and have the spin of a canteloupe in those conditions (that’s a good thing)
But you wouldn’t want a “heavier” ball when pitching a knuckleball as the increased weight would decrease the knuckle. Also, don’t you want a knuckleball to turn over/rotate at least once on the way to the plate in order to change to air flow to provide a sudden change in direction?
History of math begins back in 1800BC by the Egyptians. They studies unit fractions, circle measurements, linear equations… and of course counting.
I didn’t realize so much advanced physics went in to knuckleballs. Maybe Craig Breslow should learn to throw one.
I would have either Liriano or Slowey pitch every other start. They would still pitch on four days rest. Everyone else would have six days rest.
1. LIRIANO
2. Perkins
3. SLOWEY
4. Blackburn
5. LIRIANO
6. Dickey
7. SLOWEY
8. Perkins
9. LIRIANO
10. Blackburn
11. SLOWEY
Ben W,
Physics and math rule the world. I promise.
And history of math is a class that I have to take for my math ed requirement.
Cuddaver just hit a triple over Drew’s head, scoring Casilla
Kubel with a diving catch at deep left center
Where you getting your info, thrylos?
I finally found a station……listening to Gordo now.
“Physics and math rule the world.”
Then its time for me to get out, before I yawn myself to death.
Silver lining…
Looks like both Mauer and Baker will stay back in FL. At least they’ll be able to get more used to each other. And the ARE our #1 battery.
Physics and math and a bunch of other nonsense.
Best of luck to you, trish.
Gomez sails his throw 20 feet wide of home.
tie game
Where you getting your info, thrylos?
mlb.tv TRN
game tied runners at 2nd and 3rd, 1 out.
Baker will be back in time for his 3rd start, the world is not ending. Im actually more excited to go to opening day now, to see the Franchise in action.
“Liriano struggling a bit…”
And Gladden just compared the Gomez throw to the good ol’ days of Jacque Jones throwing.
A good time to remind myself, it’s only ST.
they only have the radio on the internet site that sucks i’m paying for both radio and tv. i suppose i shouldn’t watch tv at work anyway.
Anyone thinking conspiracy theory. Give Humber/Dickey a few more days to prove themselves against Major league hitters to see if they are willing to throw Humber on waivers? See what Duensing can really provide? Pushing Baker back one start (not been effective this spring) will not make a big deal for the year.
“And Gladden just compared the Gomez throw to the good ol’ days of Jacque Jones throwing.”
The Twins just don’t have enough Caucasian outfielders to make Gladden happy.
Doesn’t Boof have to go on the 60-day DL to make room for Dickey?
Cuddy is looking better than ever.
Find a nice seat on the bench Span - your days as starter are numbered.
anyone thinking conspiracy theory is a complete idiot. NO team is going to take ther top starter out of the lineup to experiment with the end of the bench players. I am sure that is why Mauer is on the DL too just so Billy Smith can see his AAA catchers can do.
Doesn’t Boof have to go on the 60-day DL to make room for Dickey?
Unless someone else is traded. They have until Monday to make that decision.
or maybe Gomez needs to sit instead of span…
“Find a nice seat on the bench Span - your days as starter are numbered.”
And that number is currently 200 days.
wouldnt it make sense for Boof to just go to the 60 day anyway? he’s not going to be back this season most likely (and I don’t want him back anyway…)
sy
200 days from when he started last year?
wouldnt it make sense for Boof to just go to the 60 day anyway?
it does. He is currently in the 15 day. They can move him whenever they want to.
If Gomez and Span are sitting, they still cover more ground than Cuddyer, Young and Kubel.
thrylos98,
I believe they have to set the 25-man roster after the game on Saturday.
anyone here play fantasy? I know T-Rish does.
cmath,
how did you find out that Cardinal scouts are attending the Twins’ games?
Greeeeeeeat ….
Gladden said it on the air the other day.
Can someone explain to me why putting Boof on the 60-day-DL NOW, would DECREASE the roster flexibility?
Makes no sense to me…….but neither does hip-hop.
sy…..
Love the 12:34 post.
Matt,
I love the fact that you are not calling me t-rish.
Weak groundout by Span. 0-2.
Another weak grounder to short for Span. He’s reverting to what we saw in 2007. I wonder if he needs more eye surgery.
I believe they have to set the 25-man roster after the game on Saturday.
yes, but they can be flexible. For example:
If Dickie is the 5th starter and not needed before the 10th, they can start with 11 pitchers and all 3 of Buscher, Harris, Tolbert and option one of the optionable 2 down when Dickie needs to come up. This would be a very smart move. This is exactly what the Mets are doing with Nick Evans and Livan Hernadez (their 5th pitcher)
Not time to panic yet. Spam still has two ST games to get unstuck.
Duensing in. Liriano out to rest
SPAM®
3 innings and done. franchise (small case on purpose) throws 43 pitches.
And we’ll see you on My29 Monday, Francisco!!
“The Twins just don’t have enough Caucasian outfielders to make Gladden happy.”
His wife isn’t. Why would he care if the outfielders are?
2 run homer off Duensing
when someone is put on the 60 day dl you can replace them on the 40 man roster. if dickey isn’t on the 40 man they will move boof to the 60 day and add dickey to fill his spot. they may be waiting until the final roster is set and maybe a cut or trade is made.
2 run hr that sucks.
Wonderful…….
Dunce-sing gets in through the back door, now he can’t find the plate.
Punto dropped an infield fly
“they may be waiting until the final roster is set and maybe a cut or trade is made.”
WHY?
What is the advantage to waiting?
Please “splain”, Lucy.
Dazzle:
“Shtiftnest in the right shoulder…”
Yikes…….
“Please “splain”, Lucy.”
They’ve been operating on the old broken blog clock.
Things to change soon.
romer,
SOMEBODY has to make the team as the 12th pitcher since it has been preordained that that is how many the team will carry.
Shtifnest?
Who is the announcer?
Colonel Klink?
WHY?
What is the advantage to waiting?
here is one:
They might not be convinced that Duensing should go North and try to figure out who should replace him. If it Swarzak (who is on the 40 man) they need only one spot. If it is Mulvey, who is not, or Delaney, who is not, they would need 2 spots. And they don’t have to make this decision now, so why make it?
so, since Duensing is not pitching well (at all), who would be the 12th pitcher if not him?
How did Liriano pitch? pitch count in his 3 innings? all i have is the mlb.com box score. thanks!
msm, see above
so I know no one will care… but I come up to my History of Math class because it is usually empty beforehand. I arrive at the class and there is this one guy lecturing to this other guy. And it sounds like he is actually teaching to a class of 30 instead of just 1. Kinda makes me confused and mad because I can’t sit down in my classroom. Ugh.
Anyways… What is it against Boston that we can’t keep the ball in the park?
“…since it has been preordained that that is how many the team will carry.”
Another example of old-clock thinking.
Cuddaver with an RBI double
The only decision they should make NOW, would be to put Bonser on the 60-day-DL.
Its not even a decision.
HE GONE!!!!
I still see no advantage to delaying THAT non-decision.
Crede drives Cuddyer in, score tied.
T-Rish
it fits you (you did say ‘not’ but i think you meant ‘now’, right?)
Cuddy in the 3-hole? I think so.
Thry
Ok. I’d love to see Delaney or Swarzak. Heck, even Keppel and Gosling looked ok in their outtings.
“pitch count in his 3 innings?”
Like I said at 12:56, 43.
Time to catch up to the new clock, danimals.
:)>
sane i may be wrong as usual but i think they can’t put players on the 60 day until the final roster is set. so if that is sunday they would move him then. guess they don’t need to move dickey to the 40 man until then. of course, this is all uniformed speculation.
the advantage to waiting is things may change, no reason to do it until they have to. why do it today if you can put it off until later, is my motto.
“Francisco Liriano will start Monday’s opener against Seattle, with Nick Blackburn, Kevin Slowey and Glen Perkins following the next three games. There is word R.A. Dickey likely will start April 10 at Chicago, as the team’s No. 5 starter.”
Just a question, shouldn’t it be Slowey, Perkins, and THEN Blackburn following those games? Not sure if this was meant to go in respective order or not or it was not regaurded.
T98, true they don’t have to add Dickey to the roster until 4/10.
There is no way Bonser is going to pitch this season (Definitely past 60 days), so what is the point of not putting him on the 60-day DL immediately?
The only decision they should make NOW, would be to put Bonser on the 60-day-DL.
ok, I did not make myself clear. Here is the rule about the 60-day list:
There is no limit on the number of players per club, but it may be used only when a club is at the maximum of 40 players
which means, once they put Buscher, there, they need to name his replacement to keep the roster to 40. You cannot move him to the 60-day and leave the roster at 39…
Dazzle believes Red is the oldest member of “this Twins squad”.
Look it up and be sure, Dano.
“Look it, Dano” (ouch)
SweetOne,
I hope that the 1:09 comment explains why they cannot do it.
ggg, they CAN put players on the 60-day DL - they did it with Neshek.
The only reason that I can figure is that the Twins may want to start the season with a 39-man-roster (plus Bonser) to save a couple of dollars.
“What is it against Boston that we can’t keep the ball in the park?”
Maybe because they are pretty good.
ggg,
They put Neshek on the 60-day over a month ago.
T98,
Thanks, that clears it up.
“they need to name his replacement to keep the roster to 40.”
His replacement is Dickey.
And after a potential trade, someone else may replace Dickey instead of replacing Bonser.
The advantage is still invisible.
sane,
are you sure that they know who that 40th man is or whether they would bring another player up instead of Duensing who would need the spot (Henn, Keppel, Mulvey, Delaney all would need an extra spot), resulting in 2 spots needed (additional = Dickey). Dickey can wait to be added until the 10th. They need to figure out whether Duensing or someone else comes up before the make the move. (again, they cannot move Boof without adding someone)
“…I can’t sit down in my classroom. Ugh.”
Having Ziggy day, trish?
And BTW, don’t worry about this good-natured turd tossing you’re getting a bit today. I LOVED math. Very valuable.
You’ll be able to balance your checkbook, set clocks correctly, and someday you can name your son Thrylos.
Twins pitch to contact + Red Sox have a lot of power = put it on the board, yes.
Or maybe the Twinkies are just intimidated like when they play against the Yankees.
The advantage is never having to pay Dickey a MLB salary until Opening Day.
That saves the Twins a couple days of salary.
Got it!
No, it’s just that the Twins have no (mathematical) chance to win the Mayor’s Cup. So they’re a little lackluster.
sane,
simple question: would you rather have them start the season with a pitcher that would be sitting the first 4 days or rather have an extra position player or another arm these 4 days?
That is the advantage for waiting to add Dickie.
The advantage is never having to pay Dickey (or whomever) a MLB salary until Opening Day
Better to start with 11 pitchers and Dickey waiting for his cue.
But, I have $10 that says the Twins aren’t planning to do that.
thrylos98,
You are accusing the Twins of thinking outside the box.
They have a clean rap sheet on that type of activity.
Talk about jinxing…
Gladdy&Gordo talking about who the emergency catcher would be.
“thrylos98,
You are accusing the Twins of thinking outside the box.
They have a clean rap sheet on that type of activity.”
Thanks for the laugh Sane… Definitely a true statement to some degree
Romer
morneau, hands down.
with regards to that i am really surprised with morales over butera
with butera yuo have a good arm and glove, but suspect offense can be hidden if you put him in the 9 spot. morales isnt a bad hitter but his glove is still below average and his arm is hurrendous.
Well if I do end up going to the Twins-Sox game on April 11, at least I get to see the Franchise!
Shaun,
My friend Dan is going to that game… has tickets right behind home plate, and now is thrilled that he will get to see Franchise instead of Baker. Hope you get to go and enjoy what should be a great game!
msm, you can hide suspect offense in the 9 hole.
Gardy also hides suspect offense in the 7 and 8 holes, and sometimes even the 2 hole.
romer said: “Time to catch up to the new clock, danimals.”
I guess i’m still in ST, too. Actually, i should be cut.
“morneau, hands down.”
Yeah, that’ll be good for his back.
Gordon say Tolbert, if he makes the team.
So that means Tolbert is now a shoe-in, huh…
Ben W
well put; how I love Gardy.
romer
remember, its Crede with the back problems (yes Morneau tweaked his, but he should be fine)
if Tolbert can catch, keep the kid for life.
Span 0-3 AGAIN this has to be the worst spring EVER by a Twins player. If Gardy keeps to his word which was “spring will decide who plays in the outfield” Span wont be in the lineup opening day. However I doubt that is gona happen. Hopefully he can turn it around when the season starts, and if he doesnt Gardy pulls the plug quickly. Again not likely to happen
“so, since Duensing is not pitching well (at all), who would be the 12th pitcher if not him?”
Does it really matter when you are digging that far down into the barrel?
SPAM Lite®
Sane,
They wouldn’t save any money if they added Dickey today or Monday. They would if they waited until 4/10.
Players officially only get paid from game 1 to game 162. Everything else the work for free.
“remember, its Crede with the back problems (yes Morneau tweaked his, but he should be fine)”
Remember, Morneau had leg probs last Sept. Which often translates to back probs.
Good to see Cuddy’s offense today as he subs at 1B. I hope this means MVP will get his rest this year. (But then there’s Cuddy’s D at 1B…)
Huh…..no comments on Punto being taken out today. Wonder how bad his “injury” is.
Ayala comes through, pitches tough.
here is a nice, warming thought: other than Slowey, Nathan, Guerrier and Breslow, the projected members of the Twins’ staff all had surgeries of some sort or another in their careers:
Liriano: elbow (TJ)
Blackburn: knee
Perkins: shoulder
Dickey: elbow
Ayala: elbow (TJ)
Crain: shoulder
Duensing: elbow (TJ)
Humber: elbow (TJ)
thrylos, I think I remember something with nathans arm from his giants days.
“you can hide suspect offense in the 9 hole.”
That may delay it, but it won’t hide it.
All nine guys have to bat.
Rob, you’re correct. Nathan had shoulder surgery as well… only 3 ok
Gladden has Portes in the Bigs already, on the basis of one good baserunning play.
Sweet one,
“They wouldn’t save any money if they added Dickey today or Monday. They would if they waited until 4/10.
Players officially only get paid from game 1 to game 162. Everything else the work for free.”
Good point.
I immediately retract my accusation of the Twins’ “alleged cheapness”.
I would not want to set that perception in motion.
So currently, it’s
Punto
Crede
Young
M
&M
Baker
Hon. Mention - Crede
If you get the rash (of injuries), it might as well be in ST.
T-Rish
Once again. I’m not trish. In fact I find it amusing that you continue to hit on her even though you’re apparently quite confident it’s me.
…says,
IMHO Regarding your 12:09 post. There are 2 forces (really 3 if you count wishing real hard) that affect the direction of a pitched ball. Gravity and differences in the air pressure around the ball. My understanding of the term “heavy” is that these forces align to make the ball appear to the batter to go down more than it should from gravity alone. Colder weather makes the air denser so the relative air pressure differences are greater having more effect on the ball.
Also it is my experience that the more a knuckleball rotates (even 1 turn) the more predictable its direction is to the batter.
I don’t get you T…
And the random ppl in the classroom and actually presenting in our class today. Not too excited about this. Won’t allow me to goof off like I usually do. bummer
Checking out, time for a nap
First I’ll get on my knees and pray to the BB gods for no more injuries.
sane,
You really seem on your game today.
Span is due up, Ill never post again if he gets a hit.
I get T, trish.
He was talking to medschoolmatt, right?
ya… he was. I’m assuming since he is hyphenating my name, the first part is just him, and then I am just rish. that is why i always do t-rish. no capital T to confuse T.
Just when you thought you’d seen the last of Toby Gardenhire…
OMG he got on base, not a hit though.
her name is T-Rish. not ‘T’.
and I have AIM if I want to hit on her
Paul,
“You really seem on your game today”
I was actually more proud of myself yesterday when I told “Jim Marshall” that next time he picked up a fumble, he should make sure he was wearing his GPS.
oh so t-rish it is then
happy?
Sane is always on his game; its when hes not that you take notice.
At least Gomez can still bunt for a hit when he’s in a slump. Span can only pray for a base on balls.
i heard my man got on base… goodie
WJ
honestly I don’t know why pitchers don’t just throw it hard down the middle. Span seems to have forgotten how to make contact.
Cuddyer is 2-2, 2B, 3B and three RBI.
I will no longer call him Cuddaver.
HE’S ALIVE!
HE’S ALIVE!
sane,
That is good!
Any time now Vavra can tell Span to forget what he’s trying to teach him and just swing like you used to.
Any time now Smith can tell Vavra not to teach every hitter to go to the opposite field.
brookshirebabewatcher,
we can only hope that happens sooner than later…
trish,
“i heard my man got on base… goodie”
The rumor is that Toby does not even try to get to first base.
from history of math class:
“Euler is ‘Da Man’”
Sy,
you cannot say those things when I am in class because it makes me want to laugh out loud!
bbw,
Who do you think taught Span to swing like he used to?
sane
I think vavra is the one that made him good in the first place; I just think he’s forgetting what he learned.
Who do you think taught Span to swing like he used to?
Riccardo Ingram
Yesterday the Brewers released Mike Lamb, today they signed Jason Tyner.
i think the brewers and tigers are looking in the Twins bargain bin for steals.
thry, that could be. All I know is Vavra is trying to change Span’s swing. I should of stayed down there till next monday instead of leaving this monday. I could of asked Span.
Did’nt see this coming but why not pitch Slowey on full days rest and Cisco on his original day Tue???
Wasn’t Lew Ford available?
Good for Tyner!
IF Span & Crede keep up their Spring Training efforts during the season, it will make Punto’s 2007 practically “Ruthian” 
Regards,
Dustan Martin is a name to remember. He certainly looked good to me.
Lew got an invite from the Rockies. I wonder how he’s doing.
Is Ricardo Ingram the guy who taught Casilla to hit .219 at AAA, before he Vavra taught him to hit .281 in MLB?
Ask him, sane.
If Vavra was trying to change Span’s swing, then he was violating the First Commandment of batting instruction, which begins:
“If it ain’t broke….”
That is the same First Commandment that Span should have been following.
Whatever Lineup Gardy puts out tomorrow will be the opening day lineup. Managers generally like to throw the opening day lineup out there a couple of times before the season starts. Im gona puke if Delmon is out and Span is in.
My understanding of the term “heavy” is that these forces align to make the ball appear to the batter to go down more than it should from gravity alone.
I think the idea proposed was that the ball would be wet and therefore take on more weight/mass. Now, this certainly wouldn’t affect the drop from gravity but it would inhibit the ability of the differences in air pressure to act on the ball.
Colder weather makes the air denser so the relative air pressure differences are greater having more effect on the ball.
Yes, but the first time I went to the Dome as a little kid I remember learning, by losing my hat upon exit, that the Dome is pressurized. Not sure if this makes a difference.
Also it is my experience that the more a knuckleball rotates (even 1 turn) the more predictable its direction is to the batter.
Just found where I had read about the rotation thing (see link below). Here is the excerpt:
The knuckleball is another matter. It spins far too slowly to compete with a curveball on its own terms. The sideways force comes from the stitches instead. But as pitchers know, and scientists have rediscovered, a knuckleball with zero spin is ineffectual - a slow roll, even if just a few degrees per second, gives the knuckleball its kinks.
http://www.nytimes.com/1987/09/08/science/secret-of-knuckleball-s-dance-revealed.html
Young has earned his spot on opening day line-up. Span, not so much. I’m with ya Rob
“But as pitchers know, and scientists have rediscovered, a knuckleball with zero spin is ineffectual”
In a wind tunnel, yes.
In a cross wind, NO!
The issue is we will be facing a dominate RHP the first game. With that in mind, Span and Kubel will be in the lineup. That leaves Gomez, Young, Cuddy for the last spot in the lineup.
Aaron it leaves Gomez and Young
Span needs to go back to what he did in 2008 to get hit swing back, i.e. start the season in Rochester!
“That leaves Gomez, Young, Cuddy for the last spot in the lineup.”
Last TWO spots?
WJ,
“Span needs to go back to what he did in 2008 to get hit swing back, i.e. start the season in Rochester!”
You may be right.
He needs some kind of a “new start” to 2009, at least for his mental/emotional health.
As long as its just one or two starts it will be fine.
Any time now Vavra can tell Span to forget what he’s trying to teach him and just swing like you used to.
Perhaps Span IS ’swinging like he used to.’
Keiunta has never hit a lick prior to last season.
Ive said it since day one of spring training the man is a head case, over emotional. I believe I had a brief discussion with WJ. BTW USACHIEF your email and name were just in my name and email field, how the hell does that happen?
Yeah! Twins! Any day and any way you beat the Red Sox is a very good day indeed!
In a wind tunnel, yes.
In a cross wind, NO!
Good point. But there won’t be a cross wind in the Dome. So I guess the question is: With all other variables constant, would a 70 mph knuckleball be more successful under which of the following conditions.
1) 149 gram ball @ 1 RPS in a 70 F pressurized Dome no wind.
2) 155 gram ball (added moisture weight) @ 0 RPS in a 40 F Cell w/ 10mph cross wind.
Still, I’d rather see Span on the bench than Pridie. He can PR and be a defensive replacement until he gets his act straight.
thrylos98,
You are right of course. The main benefit to having him sent down is that Gardy can’t “keep running him out there” if he is in Rochester.
Wouldn’t mind seeing Martin get a shot.
…says,
“would a 70 mph knuckleball be more successful under which of the following conditions.
1) 149 gram ball @ 1 RPS in a 70 F pressurized Dome no wind.
2) 155 gram ball (added moisture weight) @ 0 RPS in a 40 F Cell w/ 10mph cross wind.”
Good question and difficult test to run.
I’ll take the 1 rps pitch, because I think the break will be less predictable than the crosswind-driven break.
That was just a guess.
Here it comes, you guys are finally starting to bash Span. I was wondering when 98 and WJ would agree…
Rob,
I’ve been bashing Span since well before Spring Training started. And I must say I feel vindicated.
Wouldn’t mind seeing Martin get a shot.
me, too; but he is not in the 40-man roster…
“me, too; but he is not in the 40-man roster…”
At least not until our NEXT 60-day-DL injury…….
Span is swinging like he used to. He’s feeling for the ball and slapping it the opposite way. Last year, he drove the ball because everybody pitched him inside. This year, everybody is pitching him away and he’s slapping it. He’ll need to learn how to drive the ball the opposite way if he wants to stay in the line-up.
Punto’s injury is a reminder why they can’t get rid of Harris. No matter how serious Punto’s injury is, they need the depth. Punto’s always one head-first slide away from the DL.
Here it comes, you guys are finally starting to bash Span.
I need to go back and find my posts from 2008. I know on more than one occasion I had Span and Casilla picked as the guys that would likely get absolutely torn asunder by Stribgoers the moment they started to show any sign of struggle.
I was called crazy for it too.
sane,
Yes, last 2 spots in the lineup. If you have Span in RF/LF and Kubel DH that leaves CF and RF/LF.
That is 2 spots to me.
You never know when a pitcher(s) will go down. That’s why the Twins are always reluctant to give up pitching in a trade. You can never have too much pitching.
cmath,
actually most of Span’s hits last season were in the opposite field. Here is a link to his spray chart:
http://minnesota.twins.mlb.com/stats/individual_player_hitting_chart.jsp?playerID=452655&statType=1
I have no idea what Span will do going forward, but I was (and posted) in favor of “selling high” on Span this winter.
For one, I doubted (and still doubt) he’s as good a hitter as he looked last year, and two, outfield depth is nice, but not a luxery a team like the Twins can really afford when there are other needs, and in a market where corner outfielders are a dime a dozen.
For the record, my doubts about Span have little to do with his spring training batting average.
Span would’ve looked pretty valuable to a team looking for a center fielder this past winter.
That’s why the Twins are always reluctant to give up pitching in a trade
the last 3 trades they made(Garza, Santana, Nolte) all involved pitchers
Make it 4, if you include Hamburger for Yesterday Eddie
I’m fine with Span if we don’t have Gomez. Span should only play CF. Giving up too much power with him as one of the corner outfielders. I remember when everyone wanted to get rid of Delmon for the same reason. Maybe if Gomez develops into a power hitter, Span will be a better fit. To be clear, I LIKE Span on the team (as 4th OF). Disagree totally that he definately HAS to be a starter.
Getting Bigger Everyday Eddie
98: I looked at that chart. Looks like a pretty equal distribution with a heavy concentration up the middle to me. This spring, I can count on one hand the number of balls he’s pulled.
Chief, rumor has it, we could have gotten Beltre for Span and Humber or Bonser. I suppose that’s moot with Crede.
cmath,
the other thing that Spad did not do this spring was to bunt. Carew always used to say that he bunted his way out of a slump. Span should have tried that himself…
This spring, I can count on one hand the number of balls he’s pulled.
Sounds about right since you can just about count on two hands Span’s total hits this spring.
With Span, the Twins had a guy who could hit leadoff and do so consistently. I was one of those who felt it would’ve been a mistake to deal him…
Span would’ve looked pretty valuable to a team looking for a center fielder this past winter.
The reasons he looked so valuable were the same reasons the Twins couldn’t afford to give him up.
As he was hitting in 2008, Span appeared to figure out what he was doing wrong. And thusly was able to take over the leadoff spot (something the Twins have needed since Stewart left and once Castillo showed his age)
Gomez or Casilla were the only other options. Gomez had sturggled leading off…and had started to bounce back once getting dropped in the order. Casilla? Didn’t have many opportunities hitting behind Span.
Gomez has since stepped it up this Spring, to the point where I think he could do lead off.
Span has dropped off since, but would still have value to a team. Not the Jacoby Ellsbury type value, but I don’t think he had that high of value to begin with.
But at the same time, dealing Span means the Twins only have 3 OFs. And i don’t think anybody wants to see Punto, Kubel, Tolbert, or who knows what else on days when one of the three starters needs a day off.
Everyday Value Meal Eddie
Dennys Grand Slam Reyes
Jose Buffet Mijares
It was fun to watch those three amigos.
But at the same time, dealing Span means the Twins only have 3 OFs.
it doesn’t (because Pridie or Martin would come up. That said, after a horrid spring is not a smart time to deal Span… on the other hand, after Butcher’s .370some spring, it’s a perfect time to try to deal him.
Span was undoubtedly the best leadoff hitter we have had in awhile, but I think the value of that has been overrated.
By the way, what were the team’s records with Gomez vs. Span leading off?
what were the team’s records with Gomez vs. Span leading off?
Much higher with Gomez leading off than with Span. Span started leading off after the winning streak was over and his leading off time included the nasty September. I’ll pull out the numbers
thrylos,
you making the trip to new Yankees stadium when the Twins come to town?
here:
With Span leading off 33-33 (.500)
With Gomez leading off 52-38 (.558)
with others leading off 3-4 (.429)
I agree that Span was a good leadoff hitter last year. He was a pretty good hitter period.
My question then, as now, is ‘what is the likelihood that’s the real Span?’
2100 minor league ABs say one thing, last season another.
I don’t know which is the real Span, but my gut tells me those 2100 ABs can’t be ignored.
you making the trip to new Yankees stadium when the Twins come to town?
I am making the trip to the iron pigs stadium when the Red Wings come to town and to Reading when the Rock Cats come to town
It will cost me about $200 (and 5-6 hrs of sitting in traffic) to see the Twins at Yankees stadium and I would need binoculars to watch. I’d rather take my kids and see 10 minor league games with that $
I gotta get to Syracuse/Scranton to watch Rochester this summer, might even get over to Roch. I will be biting the bullet for the May 16 game, tix are free but the binoculars are not.
Shawn,
I really don’t care watching baseball from 2000 feet away… that’s why the last few years I only watched the Twins in the dome (I can get good tickets there; got buddies with season tickets at 121 and 127 and worked things out with them) Plus the environment is less hostile for fans in Twins’ jerseys than Yankee Stadium
btw,
what happened to that guy (can’t remember his name) who popped up around the Crede trade time and supposedly had a girlfriend in the front office? He could have shed some light in those last cuts….
I will get to see the Twins vs the Mariners in Seattle for the 3rd year in a row. Being outside for a bb is really great. Can’t wait for Target Field.
sorry, bb game
…says,
I read the article. Thanks. You’re right about the inside of the dome being higher pressure than the outside. And I’m sure that has some effect but not quite as severe as 40 deg temp vs 70 deg.
Sorry, I thought t98 was using the term heavy as I explained it.
I think our only point of contention is the effect of zero spin vs a slight amount of spin on the trajectory of the ball. It’s my understanding that the action of a knuckleball is caused by the rapidly changing vortexes, and the attendant low pressure areas, in its wake. Just like a piece of paper fluttering to the ground. As opposed to the action of a spinning ball that has low pressure on 1 side. No doubt the seams play a role in these vortexes.
For me, based on my experience, a ball that does not spin will flutter, in what looks like as much as 1/2 inch, in every direction and appear to rock left and right or up and down. Approaching the plate this fluttering increases in distance and decreases in speed. This ball coming into the hitting zone is totally unpredictable. My experience with a rotating knuckleball, even though it moves more than one not rotating and still flutters, it is more predictable. My theory is that a pattern of vortex changes emerges and creates a trend that is similar in nature to the trend of a spinning ball.
Twins are in Chicago next Friday, Saturday, and Sunday. Always good seats at US Cellular/Sox Park. Sox fans always pumped up when the Twins are in town. Might go to see one game, which is one less game I will have to endure Ken Harrelson and his new sidekick Steve Stone.
Oops. Just read what I posted. Forgot something. Just before the best nonspinning knuckleballs reach the plate, the oscillations growing larger and slower, the seams will “grap” and the ball can tumble with a big break.
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