Watch Obama and Gov. Patrick: ‘Just words’
February 18th, 2008 – 3:19 PM by Dennis J. McGrathSen. Barack Obama has earned lots of attention for his oratorical skills — and now, his lifting of lines from another politician’s speech is bringing him even more attention.
Here’s today’s story about the flap, and Obama’s explanation: he acknowledges he should have credited Massachusetts Gov. Deval Patrick, but because Patrick encouraged him to use them, the lack of attribution is no big deal.
The video below shows how Obama used Patrick’s idea and exact words. Patrick’s speech is from October 2006, and Obama’s was given Saturday night in Wisconsin.
Do you buy Obama’s explanation? Or is this plagiarism?
46 Responses to "Watch Obama and Gov. Patrick: ‘Just words’"
It could be the beginning of his definition of “change.”
Frankly Dennis, I’m not too concerned as to who gets credit for a comment, however I would like a more detailed outline of his plan for “change.”
Obama slipped up and should have said “As my friend Massachusetts Governor Deval Patrick said…”
About a need for specifics, if (big word, I know) his words can motivate us to truly work together, the details and the specifics of a plan will come.
If people aren’t motivated by words to truly work together, the best plan in the world will fail so there’s no need to give detailed specifics - yet.
But if the words do motivate a nation and persuade us to work together, we can pull ourselves from the cynical, regressive nightmare of the Bush administration. And because the plan will be created by many, not just one person who has “all the answers to all our problems”, we will solve the problems we face, working together.
We’ve had too much “I know what’s best, don’t question me.”
I just hope Obama keeps talking.
This is ironic. Hillary and all the other candidates have been using Obama’s message of change. I smell Clinton defeat.
He is nothing but a BIG liar,we have had a liar in for 8 years and now this so called LIAR is doing the same thing BUSH is doing,another thing using somebody else’s words I just cannot believe who he thinks he is,I am so afraid of him…
Laurina
This is not a big deal. The Clinton campaign is just upset that somebody messed up the coronation.
Desperation tactics from Penn, Wolfson and Grunwald, all largely joyless and brooding political operatives. Their collective petulance is not serving Senator Clinton well, and it is hard to tell if they are framing their candidate’s positions and personality, or if they are simply reflecting them.
Gee Joe Biden got excoriated for plagiarism, now suddenly it’s no big deal? Interesting. I think you have to take the blinders off. Obama has potential there’s no doubt, but the total lack of skepticism bugs me. He’s not been tested in the national arena. My fear is if he is the Democratic standard bearer, he’ll be a lot more Jimmy Carter, than FDR. Mind you I don’t bring up JFK, who really wasn’t that great a president. He probably could not have passed the civil rights act, or the voting rights act. It took a real pol to get that done. Don’t kid yourself.
Plagiarism is the theft of someone’s work. The source of the phrase is his friend Gov. Patrick. Sen. Obama has Gov. Patrick suggested using his phrase.
Patrick has confirmed it.
No theft here. No plagiarism.
Let’s all just move along.
Move along his yellow brick road? Just close my eyes, click my heels and my Emerald City will appear? Scary movie.
He would be a Jr. Executive at best, one that needs alot of help from his friends.
The Milwaukee Journal Sentinel has some video clips of his interviews with their editorial staff.
While his memory and organizational skills are very good, I don’t think he is as good with impromptu speech. Watch his eyes as he searches for answers.
All very interesting takes, but I would still like to know what he means by change.
This has yet to be defined.
I’m very much looking forward to a Republican/Democratic debate. Obama may be asked to explain his message of change.
Is it plagiarism if the original author suggests you use the idea? Perhaps I’m mixing plagiarism with copyright infringement. Though, if Patrick says “Hey, point out that when they say ‘just words’ they’re criticizing MLK, JFK, FDR, the delaration of independence, etc.”
How many ways are there to say that? The majority of the statements of both Patrick and Obama were quotes of other people or documents. This is a tempest in a teapot.
“I would still like to know what he means by change.
This has yet to be defined.”
Not true. The point he’s been making for months and months is that the politics of us vs them where the Dems and Repubs spend more time vilifying one another are not helpful to making this country a better place for all of us. His change is to build coalitions of people - Repubs, Dems & Independents in order to work towards goals on which we all agree. More importantly, he’s talking about approaching politics from the perspective of wanting to work together, rather than presuming that a fight will ensue.
Of course, there appear to be a large number of people who might not find this approach appealing. The ultraconservative wing of the GOP that doesn’t like McCain appears to not like him primarily because of his willingness to compromise & work with Dems in order to achieve common goals. Sen Clinton, in her stump speeches, treats the GOP with similar contempt. She talks a lot about fighting them - her long experience being attacked & ’surviving’ (her words, not mine). Thus Sen Obama’s claim that another Clinton administration would be more of the same - continuing the last 15 years of partisan bickering where every decision is made with an eye towards winning the next election.
bsimon,
I don’t have a clue where you get your information, but please share with me one example of Mr. Obama voting against political lines.
Not true. The point he’s been making for months and months is that the politics of us vs them where the Dems and Repubs spend more time vilifying one another are not helpful to making this country a better place for all of us. His change is to build coalitions of people - Repubs, Dems & Independents in order to work towards goals on which we all agree. More importantly, he’s talking about approaching politics from the perspective of wanting to work together, rather than presuming that a fight will ensue.
Here you go, bsimon.
These are documented facts. The floor is yours.
Obama is a rank-and-file Democrat according to GovTrack’s own analysis of bill sponsorship. (Where do these labels come from?)
Barack Obama missed 185 of 1098 votes (17%) since Jan 6, 2005. The graph to the left shows the number of missed votes over time. Click for a larger chart.
Committee Membership
Barack Obama sits on the following committees:
Member, Senate Committee on Foreign Relations
Chairman, Subcommittee on European Affairs
Member, Subcommittee on African Affairs
Member, Subcommittee on East Asian and Pacific Affairs
Member, Subcommittee on International Development and Foreign Assistance, Economic Affairs and International Environmental Protection
Member, Senate Committee on Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions
Member, Subcommittee on Children and Families
Member, Subcommittee on Employment and Workplace Safety
Member, Senate Committee on Homeland Security and Governmental Affairs
Member, Subcommittee on Ad Hoc Subcommittee on State, Local, and Private Sector Preparedness and Integration
Member, Subcommittee on Investigations
Member, Subcommittee on Federal Financial Management, Government Information, Federal Services, and International Security
Member, Senate Committee on Veterans’ Affairs
Congressional Terms
Past and present terms in the House and Senate held by Barack Obama:
When Role State
2005-2010 U.S. Senator Illinois (was preceeded by Peter Fitzgerald)
Voting History
Statistic: Barack Obama missed 185 of 1098 votes (17%) since Jan 6, 2005 (Extremely Poor relative to peers).
Below are Barack Obama’s most recent votes.
Date Vote Vote Description
Feb 14, 2008 4:56 PM Absent Coburn Amdt. No. 4032, S. 1200: Indian Health Care Improvement Act Amendments of 2007 (On the Amendment)
Amendment Agreed to 94-0, 6 not voting
Feb 14, 2008 4:31 PM Absent Coburn Amdt. No. 4036, S. 1200: Indian Health Care Improvement Act Amendments of 2007 (On the Amendment)
Amendment Rejected 21-73, 6 not voting
Feb 14, 2008 3:27 PM Absent Coburn Amdt. No. 4034, S. 1200: Indian Health Care Improvement Act Amendments of 2007 (On the Amendment)
Amendment Rejected 28-67, 5 not voting
Feb 14, 2008 3:03 PM Absent Dorgan Amdt. No. 4082, S. 1200: Indian Health Care Improvement Act Amendments of 2007 (On the Amendment)
Amendment Agreed to 95-0, 5 not voting
Feb 13, 2008 5:24 PM Absent Tester Amdt. No. 4020, S. 1200: Indian Health Care Improvement Act Amendments of 2007 (On the Amendment)
Amendment Agreed to 95-0, 5 not voting
“I don’t have a clue where you get your information, but please share with me one example of Mr. Obama voting against political lines.”
I don’t recall saying he voted against political lines. I did talk about changing the way gov’t approaches problem solving. During his tenure in the IL Senate, he introduced a bill mandating that cops videotape questioning of felony suspects. Nobody liked the idea. The cops didn’t like it, the Republicans didn’t like it, his peers in the Dem party didn’t like it, even the anti-death penalty groups didn’t like the idea. What Obama did was work with the police to bring them around to his view. Then he worked on his Senate colleagues - both Dem and Repub. Then he worked on the Governor. The bill passed, overwhelmingly, and became law. That’s political leadership & coalition building.
bsimon says, “His change is to build coalitions of people - Repubs, Dems & Independents in order to work towards goals on which we all agree. More importantly, he’s talking about approaching politics from the perspective of wanting to work together, rather than presuming that a fight will ensue.”
Then everything he is promoting is a contridiction of his past voting record. you can’t have it both ways, bsimon. Sometimes people will say anything to achieve a goal. His goal appears to be president. Do you honestly believe, if elected, he would change his voting habits?
Why not just adhere to your past voting record if you feel strongly, and promote that as your platform. His statements are misleading according to his voting history and you seem to be trying to justify them or at least explain them.
bsimon,
Would you please supply me the recorded bill number you refer to so I can research the vote counts and the verbiage?
Thanks
“Do you honestly believe, if elected, he would change his voting habits?”
Clearly. The President doesn’t vote, he (or she) signs.
“Would you please supply me the recorded bill number you refer to so I can research the vote counts and the verbiage?”
No. You can use Google just as easily as I can.
Thanks, bsimon, for once again being you.
Michelle Obama: “For the First Time in My Adult Lifetime, I’m Really Proud of My Country”
February 18, 2008 8:24 PM
We are all going to hell.
Why isn’t anybody talking about McCain’s flip-flop on torture? He voted against the ban on waterboarding last week.
Sean,
Be sure to include all the facts included in the bill.
McCain’s vote put him in the Senate minority with 44 others. A total of 51 senators voted for the measure, which would force the CIA to follow the rules in the Army’s field manual for interrogations. The two leading Democratic presidential candidates, Sens. Hillary Rodham Clinton (N.Y.) and Barack Obama (Ill.), have said waterboarding is clearly illegal and should be banned, but neither voted on the Senate legislation because they were campaigning elsewhere.
Randy Scheunemann, McCain’s top national security adviser, said McCain was concerned about the Senate legislation’s requirement that the CIA abide by Army rules. “It’s not a vote for torture,” Scheunemann said. “This wasn’t a vote on waterboarding. This was a vote on applying the standards of the field manual to CIA personnel.”
This seems a little odd.
Senator Barack Obama was against the Iraq War since the beginning. He’s been blasting it in speeches since October 2002. He was still at it a few days ago, telling supporters: “John McCain and Hillary Clinton voted for a war in Iraq that should’ve never been authorized and never been waged. A war that is costing us thousands of precious lives and billions of dollars a week.”
Nice talk. But less than a year ago, on March 27, Senator Obama voted to fund the Iraq War to the tune of $122 billion. On April 26 he voted yes again, for a $124 billion version of the same bill. On November 16, he voted for another $50 billion. Billions of dollars a week…
Obama fans;
Enjoy this time. When the debates come, and questions need to be answered, I fear the junior Senator may be lost. He would be wise to suggest his wife shut her pie hole.
Robert, you too should enjoy this time, the waning days of a GOP presidency.
Sen. Obama is a base energizing, minority engaging, positivity inspiring, charismatic candidate.
Sen. McCain will have a difficult time turning out the base. His historical support from moderates is not going to come through for him this time for one reason.
In order to get the GOP base to the polls, he needs to talk about his pro-war position every chance he gets. If he lets conservatives forget just how much he wants to stay in Iraq, then they’ll remember about his amnesty and campaign finance votes.
Obama is running to the center. You claim you should hold up past behavior as an example of what presidents will do once in office, but in fact in order to be elected, most candidates run from where they have been historically.
Obama is having to run to the center. I do think that he has a history of bipartisanship when it counts, but he also has a history of running for office in Chicago and then Illinois. Why would his voting record indicate conservatism? That would be ineffective representation for his constituents.
Now (as president) he’ll have more, and more moderate, constituents.
McCain, on the other hand, has been in the center and needs to run to the right in order to be elected. Unfortunately, his electability came from the fact he was in the center.
He can’t be in both places at once, and the right won’t turn out for him unless he goes there. Obama, on the other hand, will have no trouble turning out the left while courting the center.
Also, since January, McCain has missed 255 votes of 450, compared to 170 for Obama (and 108 for Clinton).
Apparently, it requires that you be away from the Senate in order to campaign for the presidency. What was your point about his absenteeism?
And, further, abstaining from votes in the IL Senate is evidence of bipartisanship, not evidence to the contrary, not to mention just good politics when the vote isn’t going to change the outcome — why run up the score against the GOP if you’re trying to work with them, and why expose yourself to charges of partisanship if you’re not trying to work with them?
I’m not going to fault him for being intelligent, forward looking, and politically self interested.
It’s about time someone ran for president who had these qualities.
“Thanks, bsimon, for once again being you.”
You may rest assured, Mr Grant, that the feeling is mutual.
The DNC is my source for the vote totals, but the criteria for what makes a missed vote is the same for everyone. If the RNC kept a tally, I’d check there, too.
Can I ask you two visionaries, (justin and bsimon) how you would have reacted to the comment “For the first time in my adult lifetime, I’m really proud of my country” if this was uttered by Ms. McCain?
Be honest please.
I’m feeling magnanimous today; here’s a link to the article from which I learned about the example, above, about Obama’s leadership in passing legislation in IL.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/01/03/AR2008010303303.html
Regarding Ms Obama’s comments, I think she is guilty of hyperbole. But, lets ignore that interpretation for a moment. Here we have a black woman, who’s said that until now she hasn’t felt ‘really proud’ about her country. As a white man, I don’t think I’m in a position to question her priorities, patriotism or experience as an American - as I’m fairly certain her experiences differ substantially from mine.
bsimon,
You make me ill.
“You make me ill.”
Please see my post of February 20th, 2008 at 9:39 am.
McCain can try to explain that vote away, but he’s clearly trying to have it both ways on the torture issue.
For those interested in the legislative accomplishments of the presumed Dem nominee for President, a partial list follows. The link at the bottom takes you to a summary (the site can be used to find others’ records as well):
What has Obama done in the 3 years he’s been in the Senate?
Bills authored or co-sponsored by Obama include the Coburn-Obama Government Transparency Act of 2006 (became law), the Lugar-Obama Nuclear Non-Proliferation and Conventional Weapons Threat Reduction Act (became law), the Comprehensive Immigration Reform Act (passed the Senate), the 2007 Government Ethics Bill (became law), the Protection Against Excessive Executive Compensation Bill (in committee), and many more.
In all since he entered the U.S. Senate, Senator Obama has written 890 bills and co-sponsored another 1096.
official gov site for records is:
thomas.loc.gov
“S.J.RES.23 : A joint resolution clarifying that the use of force against Iran is not authorized by the Authorization for the Use of Military Force Against Iraq, any resolution previously adopted, or any other provision of law.” (Currently in committee)
“S.117 : A bill to amend titles 10 and 38, United States Code, to improve benefits and services for members of the Armed Forces, veterans of the Global War on Terrorism, and other veterans, to require reports on the effects of the Global War on Terrorism, and for other purposes.” (also in committee)
and one that I had already heard about:
” S.674 : A bill to require accountability and enhanced congressional oversight for personnel performing private security functions under Federal contracts, and for other purposes.” (also in committee)
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/person.xpd?id=400629&tab=bills
Praise Jesus. Our savior is on the horizon.
Change, change, change.
Mr Grant, have you had a chance to review that Wash Post article yet? Here’s a relevant excerpt:
“By showing officers that he shared many of their concerns, even going so far as to help pass other legislation they wanted, he was able to quiet the fears of many.
Obama proved persuasive enough that the bill passed both houses of the legislature, the Senate by an incredible 35 to 0. Then he talked Blagojevich into signing the bill, making Illinois the first state to require such videotaping.”
Yes. You’ve convinced me. A junior Senator with limited political knowledge, ties to a questionable church whom awarded Louis Farrakhan their prestigious “Trumpet” award and who confides in Dr. Jeremiah A. Wright Jr. who’s mission statement for his church is as follows, “We are a congregation which is Unashamedly Black and Unapologetically Christian… Our roots in the Black religious experience and tradition are deep, lasting and permanent. We are an African people, and remain “true to our native land,” the mother continent, the cradle of civilization. God has superintended our pilgrimage through the days of slavery, the days of segregation, and the long night of racism. It is God who gives us the strength and courage to continuously address injustice as a people, and as a congregation. We constantly affirm our trust in God through cultural expression of a Black worship service and ministries which address the Black Community.
Well, bsimon, I don’t know about you, but how can I not feel like Obama would look out for our best interests. I mean it’s not like he has any racial issues…does it?
Why don’t you research all the great things Mr. Farrakhan has given our society. He seems to embrace all races, especially jews.
I’m just giddy about my options.
As an added bonus, to hear a potential first lady say that she has never been proud of our great country which I have personally fought for to ensure democracy, help nations around the world, and create stable environments for millions, makes me a believer.
Are you a real person, bsimon, or do you just post idiotic statements to remind people just how ignorant the liberal left is?
Mr Grant, it is always such a delight to converse with you. Thank you for offering such unique insight into an alternative view of the world.
Full disclosure: I am a real person. However, I’m not particularly representative of the ‘liberal left’.
Lastly, this whole thread has something of a ‘theatre of the absurd’ feel to it. Its comical that someone could write a long rant about a tenuous connection to Farrakahn, and conclude with the rhetorical question “I mean it’s not like he has any racial issues…does it?”
Perhaps it is not Obama who has racial ‘issues’.
bsimon,
Answer this one simple question. If a white candidates church had a mission statement that said something to the effect of, “We are a congregation which is unashamedly white…….”
Would you suspect that would cause any conflicts with African Americans?
I seem to recall a sick group of men some referred to as the KKK with those kinds of mission statements. How is this different, and who would be a racist?
Robert, your newfound liberalism is a surprise. Do you hold similar contempt for religious institutions that have mission statements that are critical of homosexuals?
I don’t see an answer, bsimon.
We don’t want any double standards. Please re-read, or go to the Trinity Church website where you can clearly read their mission statement and get back to me.
After we have closure on that issue, lets discuss your next rant.
I don’t put much stock in religious groups’ platforms. People looking for reasons to hate have found plenty to criticize in the religions of Michele Bachmann, Keith Ellison, Mitt Romney, Mike Huckabee and, now, Barack Obama. I’m more interested in the candidate than their religion.
Based on your posts, you seem to have made up your mind about Sen Obama, and now are looking for a good reason. First you questioned ‘change’. Upon receiving a response, you ask for information on his record. Given that information, you criticize his wife with an out-of context quote. Now you’re worried about his church?
I think its good news for the country that the parties are likely to nominate McCain & Obama, who are both candidates worthy of support. Unfortunately, there are still a lot of voters who make their decisions based on misinformation. I suppose I shouldn’t be surprised, given that George Bush was elected twice.
bsimon,
To understand the candidate, shouldn’t being linked to an organization who segregates by race be discussed?
You keep avoiding my simple question.
I have not said anything negative about Obama, just posted his Church’s mission statement which I find offensive. Please answer my original question to you.
“To understand the candidate, shouldn’t being linked to an organization who segregates by race be discussed?”
You can discuss it all you want, just don’t expect to discuss it with me. I think its irrelevant.
So, bsimon,
If you decided to endorse a white candidate, (let’s not even mention political ties), and the church he was married in, and still belonged to had a mission statement saying they are “unashamedely white etc…, you would be fine with that?
Please just yes or no.
If you choose to ramble on, you will solidify my point.