Leading off….the right fielder….Denard Span……
Posted on July 22nd, 2008 – 4:31 PMBy La Velle
Twins manager Ron Gardenhire met with Carlos Gomez on Tuesday to inform him that he was being moved to the ninth spot in the batting order. Denard Span, batting .370 since being called up on June 30, will lead off tonight against the Yankees.
“If it’s better for the team, it’s better for me. Do it,” Gomez said. “You have to try different things. With myself, Denard and (Alexi) Casilla, he can mix and that’s good.
Gomez was 0 for 5 on Monday, extending his slump to a horrific 5 for 58 (.086). Gomez was batting .274 on July 2 but is now at .247.
It appeared that frustration was setting in. Gomez nearly slammed his helmet after grounding out during Monday’s game and was visibly upset as he left the clubhouse following the game. Gomez claimed he was more upset that the team lost 12-4 than his struggles at the plate.
Actually, he said he’s felt better at the plate lately.
“I don’t swing at bad pitches,” he said. “Early on, they throw a lot of balls in the dirt and I swing. The last couple days you see I don’t swing. I got my strike zone smaller.”
Nick Punto returns to the lineup after recovering from a sore left ring finger.
The CT Scan on Michael Cuddyer’s sore left middle finger/palm showed no damage to the bone. Cuddyer will meet with Twins doctor soon to figure out the next step.
And righthander Shooter Hunt, the Twins’ sandwich pick between the first and second rounds in the June draft, has been promoted from rookie league Elizabethton to Class A Beloit.
Twins (55-44): 1. Denard Span, RF. 2. Alexi Casilla, 2B. 3. Joe Mauer, C. 4. Justin Morneau, 1B. 5. Jason Kubel, DH. 6. Delmon Young, LF. 7. Brian Buscher, 3B. 8. Nick Punto, SS. 9. Carlos Gomez, CF. Pitching: Kevin Slowey.
Yankees (54-45): 1. Johnny Damon, DH. 2. The Captain, SS. 3. Bob Abreu, RF. 4. A-Rod, 3B. 5. The Moustache, 1B. 6. Robinson Cano, 2B. 7. Melky Cabrera, CF. 8.Chad Moeller, C. 9. Brett Gardner, LF. Pitching: Darrell Rasner.
359 Responses to "Leading off….the right fielder….Denard Span……"
wooooooo hooooooooo how about the whole line-up now?
i think it should be casilla and then span but this is fine for now
Now Gardy can gear up to take Hernandez out of the rotation a month or two too late.
span
casilla
mauer
mvp
young
buscher
harris
kubel
gomez
i like this lineup.
If we ‘rubes’ keep calling for it, columnists keep writing it, and KFAN guys keep calling for it maybe Gardy will do it…like now with sending NoGo to the 9th spot.
Punto better be in the lineup tonight if they want a chance to win. He’s the backbone of this team and they struggle with him out.
LaVelle can yoo get someone to check to make sure Gardy hasn’t suffered a concussion and/or aneurysm since yesterday?
Is gomez going to be the odd man out when Cuddyer gets back?
Adam: flip Buscher and Kubel and you have it. How would you explain hitting you 2nd leading hr and rbi player 8th?
“How would you explain hitting you 2nd leading hr and rbi player 8th?”
.263
.265 (lifetime)
kubel is the most overated player in recent twins history 250. average with a little pop so what. his fielding is amazing though as we all could see in the boston series. I wanna see a race between red dawg and kubel huh who would win?
“If it’s better for the team, it’s better for me. Do it,” Gomez said. “You have to try different things. With myself, Denard and (Alexi) Casilla, he can mix and that’s good.
Odd… he doesn’t SOUND like his confidence is crushed over this. Maybe it would have been ok to make the switch sooner after all, huh?
sane got to it a little before me but me and sane agree
AJ…is there a third choice in the race? I’d rather not choose between one of those for the ‘fastest’.
The kid will be all right. He’s got a big future in front of him and a few years from now we won’t even remember him batting 9th (if he’s still here).
It looks like he took it the right way. Gardy’s fears of devastation were overblown…
JimCrikket,
I think Gardy really didn’t want to mess with HIS OWN HEAD!
Gomez is more mature than Gardy!
“Fears of devastation…” That was just Gardy’s excuse for his stubborn unwillingness to make a change. Gardy seems to view making a change as an admission that he was wrong, and he just can’t stomach that.
Gomez is looking like a real class act, especially considering his age.
Any player who says: “If it’s better for the team, then it’s better for me” is okay in my book.
LEN3:
Has the hand surgeon come out of yesterday’s surgery yet? I would have thought there would have been some announcement by now about Doug Henning’s hand.
I do hope the kid finds his groove and ends up being on base 2-3 times a game when Span and Casilla come up. That would have to mean a lot of headaches for opposing pitchers.
NOt really sure how Kubel is the most overrated player in recent years. He is OPSing .791 currently despite a low batting average.
He’s saying the right things. Perhaps, emphasis on perhaps, betrayed a little, emphasis on little, frustration in mentioning that he believes his pitch selection is getting better, but if he keeps working on that it’ll start showing no matter where he’s at in the order.
Makes sense to move No-go down as he hasn’t been able to hit flies with a fly swatter lately. Now how does everyone including the media put the pressure on to dump the deal weight and extra luggage in Poof Bonser and Mike Lame.
“Gardy’s excuse for his stubborn unwillingness to make a change.”
Come on Kay. Was there a need to make a change? Were the Twins losing games? They drop two in a row and you act like the world is coming to an end. Yes, the change needed to be made, but it wasn’t keeping the team from winning. Way too many Gardy haters on this blog! Face it, he does a lot with less than most.
Gardy’s tentativeness to move Gomez is more likely a pressure from the front office to make sure their golden boy from the Santana trade has a chance to be a star. Not many stars are in the bottom 3rd of any lineup.
AJ is lying (or is it underhyping) about Kubel’s stats.
No one take him seriously.
“…250 average with a little pop…”
AJ must not appreciate his beard.
Yeah, why would you try to improve the team when you are winning? You should always wait until everything goes to pot to make really obvious and simple changes.
AJ and Sane,
Your use of batting average as a knock against Kubel tells me that you need to look a little bit deeper at his numbers.
Current OPS: .791
Minor league OPS: .887
Twins team OPS: .747
Jason Kubel is not overrated. He’s a lot closer to Morneau in terms of power than most people think.
I really don’t think there are all that many Gardy “haters” around here. I don’t hate the guy and in fact I think he’s done a very nice job with the Twins for many years.
Pointing out that he does… on occasion… get a bit pigheaded about making changes that even us half braindead bloggers see needing to be made weeks before he gives in and does it… does not mean we all hate him.
Oddly, I find it to be part of his charm. Who wants a perfect manager who always makes the right move at the right time, anyway? What would we have to talk about?
I guess there’s always the GM and Owner.
“What’s up when Cuddy comes back?”
I would have to think Monroe, no? This far into the season the team really wouldn’t be eating too much salary, and a five-man DH/OF group of Kubel, Gomez, Cuddy, Span and Young doesn’t look too bad, except for the HR numbers.
I think it’ll be hard to eat Lamb’s money this year, and unless an “injury ” befalls Monroe I don’t see where the roster space is until the roster expands.
In fact their isolated power numbers are nearly identical this season. (.190 ish)
Mike Lamb looks like me.
Gomez to ninth? It had to be done. Gardy waited as long as he could. Lets hope Gomez feels less pressure and starts hitting the ball!!! Can’t steal second walking back to the dugout!!
I’m under contract for next year, too. The Twins would have to eat that money, as well.
Look at Kubel’s month of June:
.312/.409/.433, 6 HR, 15 RBI
K:BB of 12:14
Yep–his slow start clearly made him overrated. You know why I like Kubel? Because if he gets a pitch inside, he will actually turn on it and pull it, with power. Instead of, you know, all of the other Twins “going the other way” with everything.
Because Billy, then you are like the Yankees. Instead of sticking it out and trying to get the kids to learn something you throw a bunch of money into some end-of-his-prime slugger to replace him.
Obviously, it wasn’t working with Gomez, but to throw him out every time he hits a slump (and yes, it was a horrendous slump) is unfair. He gave Go-Go a good shot at it and now he is moving on. It could be worse. Look at Rickie Weeks.
Remember, the Twins are still only 1/2 game out of first. But hey, you would probably like to see us panic and trade Cuddyer or a young pitcher for some overpaid loser.
“Was there a need to make a change? Were the Twins losing games?”
Did you read the Souhan article, Displaced? He used statistics……
Something like 269th out of 278 qualifying MLB batters in OBP.
FOR A LEADOFF HITTER?!!??!!!!!!
I was just starting to think that Gomez at the plate was turning into this year’s LNP controversy in the blogosphhere.
Thank God and Gardy we won’t have to go through all that again.
Even more then needing another hitter, to win the division, this team needs set-up help. Losing Neshek hurt more then people realize. We have blown more late inning leads then normal this year.
bloggies what the hell is ops sounds like a stat for loosers to look at and think they have a good player. stats that matter for batting OBS and Batting average what the hell is ops seriously
I’ve never been a huge Kubel fan. That said, he certainly can’t be the most over rated Twin in recent years. I suppose it depends on who is doing the “rating”, but names like Ford, Bonser, Punto, Lohse, Rincon and Silva leap to my mind in terms of being over rated, by at least some folks, before I get around to thinking about Kubel.
Heck, I would even dare to mention Hunter in that category. Not that he stunk, but I always thought he was regarded much higher than his overall performance warranted.
Amen JimCrikket.
Hey BillyHeywood:
Hernandez pitched pretty decent his last time out. I think Slowey or Blackburn will be the first to be replaced by FL when he comes up.
GoGo has looked better at the dish lately. A little more selective on pitches, less wild swings. The final Texas game he got at least two hits. It is very likely that GoGo will lead off the line-up within the next 3 weeks.
No way the front office pressured him to wait. The front office is much better off if they are winning, than if they “look good”.
Cuddeyer is by far the most over rated Twin lately. 3 mediocre to bad years, and 1 good one, and yet, everyone loves him.
I agree, Livan stays, you need one vetran in there to make a playoff run. One of the young righties gets sent down or goes the the bullpen. Liriano is in the minors for NO MORE then 2 more starts (assuming he keeps completely shutting down every team he faces, as he has for over a month now!).
“sounds like a stat for loosers”
“loosers” sounds like a description of the various brain parts of a particular poster.
Shooter Hunter is one nasty pitcher. His stuff is sick, really sick.
That is the best line-up Gardy has put out there this year.
Span hits lefties and I think Buscher could, if given the chance. Kubel can’t, and needs a better platoon partner than Monroe.
Switch Buscher and Kubel? That would be fine, or leave it. It’s not glaring, like the need for the Gomez-Span switch.
Kubel hits RHP well.
Gardy took this long to make the move becuase he is VERY stubbern and didn’t want it to look like EVERYONE else was “forcing” him to make the move. It will be the same with Liriano, but in that case, at least he can TRUELY argue that no starting pitcher has warented losing their spot, unlike Gomez who does not even deserve to be ANYWHERE in the lineup!
“…but names like Ford, Bonser, Punto, Lohse, Rincon and Silva leap to my mind..”
Crikket, wake up!
You’re actually giving a serious answer to a troll.
Have some supper, enjoy the Twins game.
AJ will be watching the White Sox tonight.
Kind regards,
Gogo has looked much better at the plate the last few games. He just isn’t catching many breaks right now. Hopefully he is on the verge…
This is a step in the right direction, though long overdue, but Gomez really needs to go down to Rochester where he should have started the season. He’s good defensively, but I don’t think they’d lose enough defensively starting Span in CF to justify putting Gomez’s -2.16 WPA in the lineup.
Versus RHP:
Carlos Gomez = Mike Lamb
Mike Lamb and Carlos Gomez have close to identical stats against RHP. Gomez has more speed to offer, but also strikes out much more often. If you like Gomez as a hitter, you should probably also like Lamb.
romer mr ops looking at ops everyone has a high ops so lets not worry about the dumb stat and look at the real stats is all im saying. Im a twins fan and i dont get why so manny bloggers think kubel is so good. he’s slow, cant field, low batting average, low obs, some pop and aparently a good ops for whatever that means.
AJ:
OPS stands for On-base percentage Plus Slugging percentage. So basically, if a guy gets on base (that is, doesn’t make many outs) and hits the ball hard, his OPS is higher. So, even though Kubel only gets a hit about 26% of the time, he walks enough and hits the ball hard enough that he can still be a productive player.
span cf
casilla 2b
mauer c
morneau 1b
BELTRE 3b
kubel rf
young lf
buscher dh
harris/punto ss
i like this look and wish they would pull the trigger on this trade….gomez can come in for defense, pinch run, and occasionally start right now…this would be as solid a lineup as we have seen in years…..jmho
Gomez hit a bunch of ground balls to the left side of the infield yesterday. If he keeps doing that he’ll leg out some hits.
and i hate the white sox by the way
Batting average is a pretty antiquaited stat and can be misleading. If you look at strictly batting average players like Jason Tyner look much better than they really are. As said above OPS is a better measure of overall offensive production, and is pretty much one of the best tools for measuring offensive output.
There are other stats that can also help put this into contact, like BABIP (which measures the batting average of balls put into play), but overall OPS is a good indicator.
Into context rather, not into contact.
Anyways, I’d recommend picking up Baseball Between the Numbers to get a better handle on some of these more advanced metrics.
AJ,
Sorry, but your real statistics describe a very specific skill. Whereas OPS takes into consideration both on base and slugging %. The fact that Kubel has an above ave OPS tells us he is an above ave offensive player.
Kubel’s fine. He’s always going to be a .260 hitter or so, but he can provide some power. Twins need bullpen help if they plan on playing into October.
I’m amazed by how many people are so quick to slam the manager. My feeling is, his results speak for themselves. The job that Gardy has done this year leading this team into contention is a flat-out miracle, and if you don’t think so, pick your butt up off the BarcaLounger, drive over to the library, pull out some old copies of newspapers and magazines, and read what the experts were saying about this team in March and April. He’s certainly the odds-on pick at this point for Manager of the Year, and if the Twins win the division, he might win unanimously. I see very limited room for griping about the man, and I think the gripers might want to think about some of the issues that face him before spouting off nonsense. When I think about the difficulties of dealing with a clubhouse full of incredibly rich, incredibly young, incredibly ego-driven head cases (a player in the Major Leagues is by definition a rich, young head case, with some notable exceptions)…when I think about the challenges of bringing along kids who really are too young to be in The Show, guding them, keeping them focused, encouraging them to drink just two beers after every game rather than four….when I think about these things, I think Gardy is one of the best leaders of a group of individuals that I have ever had the honor to observe, and I’ve observed a lot of ‘em.
I’ve never looked at a player’s OPS. It never made any sense to me.
A player with a very high OBP and a very low SLG, could have exactly the same OPS as a player who had a very low OBP and a very high SLG.
OPS only makes sense, if your conclusion is that OBP and SLG, have exactly the same value. How does one arrive at that conclusion?
The D-Backs get Rauch from Washington for a AAA 2nd baseman, He would have been a nice set up man for the Twins and the asking price was fair, to bad we missed the boat on that one.
I’ll be watching the game on Mute so that I won’t have to hear Dick Bremer wax poetic about Yankee Stadium.
FSN is really going over-the-top with their “great moments in Yankee Stadium history” segments during the game. No wonder the Twins are terrified of playing there.
Because both OBP and SLG assign the same value per base. A double is worth two singles, a triple is worth three singles, a HR is worth two doubles and so on.
i never said kubel was awful but im just saying he aint justin morneau like most of you thought he was at the beginning of the season. I remember group named play kubel or something but i think cuddyer and kubel will split time
“i dont get why so manny bloggers think kubel is so good…”
Okay, AJ. Confession is good for the soul.
I believe Kubel is producing HR’s at a faster rate than Morneau this year.
I don’t get why people are so down on Kubel. He’s a damned good DH.
And thanks for not liking the White Sox.
So, we’re back in business.
:)>
Come on Kay. Was there a need to make a change? Were the Twins losing games?
Just because we’re winning doesn’t mean there’s no room for improvement. It’s the same thing with Lirano. If Liriano can pitch better than one of the starters, bring him up here regardless of how that starter is doing in the win-loss column.
Just because Gomez is not batting leadoff, doesn’t mean he can’t help the team. It just means there are better players (Span & Casilla) who are better suited for the leadoff position. With less pressure on him now hopefully he can improve his bat and help the Twins win. Lets not forget, he is still very young.
As a general response to AJ and others who are wary of OPS:
Why batting average is a bad statistic:
Batting average only measures hits per at bat. It takes no account of a batter’s ability to take walks or hit for power. For example, let’s say Joe Mauer hits .350 in 2010 by getting 175 hits in 500 at bats. Based on batting average, we have no idea if Joe hit for power, walked at all, or generally whether or not he contributed offensively. Sure, .350 is a great batting average, but 20 homers, 30 doubles and 125 singles shows up just the same as 175 singles if you’re just measuring by batting average.
Why OPS is a better offensive stat:
Let’s take the two examples above again. 175 singles in 500 at bats gives you a .350 batting average. Throw in 50 walks, and you’ve got a .409 on-base percentage. However, 175 singles also gives you just a .350 slugging percentage. Joe’s OPS, in this case, is .759 (which isn’t bad, by the way).
If, however, Joe hit 20 homers, 30 doubles and 125 singles in 500 at bats to go with his 50 walks, we get (again) a .350 batting average and a .409 OBP, but this time he has a nice .530 slugging percentage. This time, his OPS is .939, which, from a catcher, is probably MVP-worthy. Both of these hypothetical seasons had a .350 batting average, but by looking at OPS, we can clearly see which season was more valuable.
Kubel is fine the problem is no righthanded power in the everyday line up. But we all know this. I think we bring up Liriano move Blackburn to the pen and cut Bass, use Blackburn as a spot starter if needed, he deserves to stay in the bigs.
You implied he was when you described him as a .250 hitter with a little pop, which is pretty inaccurate.
Kubel isn’t Morneau I agree, but the point was he’s a lot closer to that end of the scale than the poor end some try to lump him into.
As stated above Kubel’s offensive output since about Mid-may forward has been very avove average, and it’s worth noting that his BBAIP is a full 49 points lower than Morneau. So when it comes to OBP and BA, which you seem more concerned with, Morneau has been a bit more “lucky” then Kubel with hits falling in, but as the season wears on they shoud even out more.
David why would you move Blackburn to the pen instead of Hernandez. He’s only had a few bad stards, Hernandez on the other hand is giving up hits at a historic rate.
“BABIP (which measures the batting average of balls put into play),”
Now what on earth could that tell you? That a guy who fails to put the ball in play, gets to have a higher BABIP? Raise your BABIP by whiffing? Strikeouts don’t count anymore?
Sheesh!
BABIP is a more useful stat for determining a pitcher’s effectiveness than a hitter’s.
Striking out would not raise your BABIP. It’s a measure of hits / balls in play.
my bad guys. I was wrong. I’m a clueless dumbass.
I would move Blackburn because I feel he would be more effective in that role, in other words if I had to choose between Hernandez or Blackburn to come into an inning and keep the game close or get a few out I would choose Blackburn. Also as bad as some of Hernadez’s starts have been I think he is still going about 6 innings per start that will save the bull pen.
I agree it’s more useful for pitchers, but it does have value in putting some offensive stats into context. For instance if a hitter is producing at a level much greater than his history indicates he should, but has a BABIP well above his career average it tends to indicate he probably indicates you’re looking at a sample size / luck issue.
Man I can’t type today.
Anyways David why not just DFA Hernandez and pull someone up from Rochester?
Kubel would be a lot better if he was our full time DH. I know his splits vs LHP aren’t good, but give him time and let him work on that. If he never faces lefties, he’ll never improve. The fact is, as Romer says, he’s hitting HR’s at a faster pace than Morneau. That doesn’t mean he’s better, of course not, but it does mean he could be a very good DH in the league. It’s not easy to find a rhythm as a hitter if you’re being pulled from the lineup 2-3 times a week.
My only concern with this lineup is we now have 4 of our first 5 hitters batting from the left side. Remember when we all griped about Gardy and his R-L-R-L nonsense. How the times have changed.
So are you telling me a SO is considered a ball put in play?
Hernandez has worked hard and done everything the Twins have asked. I think it would look bad to DFA him and also would be very unpopular with the team.
Kubel’s last 126 Major League games coming into the Yankees series’ (I calculated the numbers during a discussion on Sinker’s blog):
.289/.366/.492, making for an .858 OPS
He’s 118-409 with 24 doubles, 4 triples, 17 HR, 69 RBI, and 50 BB.
If you project that out over 550 ABs, Kubel’s line with regular playing time for a season would be:
.289/.366/.492 with 23 HR, 93 RBI, 32 2B, 5 3B, and 67 BB…
For comparison, that’s roughly the same season Jose Guillen put up last year, and he signed a three-year, $36MM contract this offseason. Granted, I think he was vastly overpaid, but my point is that getting those numbers from Kubel at his current price is a bargain.
Plus, I’m a believer in the fact that with regular playing time as the everyday DH, those numbers could increase slightly, and his average could approach .300, with his slugging topping the .500 mark.
I think Kubel is actually very underrated, but that’s just my opinion.
I feel as others do that the Twins need a guy like Hernandez for the rest of the season considering most of are other starters have never pitched 200 or more innings in a season. Even if he is having a bad game you can leave him in and save your bull pen unlike last night. I think he is better suited to handle a beating like last night than the young guys.
He is hitting HR’s at a faster pace partially because he isn’t getting a lot of ABs against lefties. He just looks awful at the plate against lefties. We have better options right now.
Lets face it there are times in the season were a starter is going to get pounded and the manager needs to leave him in to save the bull pen and Hernandez is that guy.
As a full time DH his numbers will increase? Have you seen his ABs against lefties? I am sorry, but the part time DH role is only helping his averages.
And tomjh–
good post. there are better stats than batting average.
I think there is one variable with Gomez that none of us bloggers really has a good read on. And that is the swagger, confidence and fun he brings to the clubhouse.
Of course, I don’t know how much Gomez “brings it” everyday, but it seems like (Stats aside) he is a guy you want in the clubhouse. A little energy can’t hurt, especially since Gomez seems to put the team first, AND especially because our leaders (M&M boys) seem to be quiet, go out and do my job, kinda guys.
I am happy with this move only because I think Gomez can thrive as a hitter, when he doesn’t have the pressure of batting leadoff (bunting and getting on base). I’ve posted this before but I think Gomez could be a great RBI man depending on how he develops - he has the tools and it seems the attitude for it (with RISP, OPS/SLG/AVG:.382/.438/.313).
I thought the Guru, backed off on OPS, considering OBP to have a higher value than SLG? Maybe the Guru changed his mind again.
I’m a clueless dumbass
Don’t beat yourself up. You’re not a dumbass.
casilla
punto
mauer
morneau
kubel/monroe
young
buscher/harris
gomez
span
everyone is protected.
No Craig, by definition a K would not be a ball put in play.
BAbip: (H-HR)/ (AB - SO - HR + SF)
Trust me, this tells you nothing about a hitter.
How is he going to get better against lefties if he’s nefer in the lineup to face them? Anyway, he can’t do much worse than Monroe against LHP.
Kubel vs LHP
243avg .282obp .405slg .687ops
Monroe vs LHP
130avg .221obp .221slg .442ops
I will be an all star at least once, before my career is over.
Well, think about the intent of the statistic and work your way backwards through the logic, Craig.
Let’s take it from a pitcher’s perspective. If you have two pitchers with similar stats on different teams, but one had an abnormally high BABIP compared to his career average and the other had an abormally low BABIP compared to his average what would that tell you?
Hard to believe Gardy juggling the lineup when his team is winning. Maybe he caved to public opinion. But he was right about Delmon, so this will probably turn out OK also. Gomez will still lead off plenty of innings, so it’s not like he’s getting benched.
Why give up an out early right there? Casilla was one of the guys last night who was stroking the ball.
What the stat tells me from a hitting perspective, is the more a batter makes an out by whiffing, his BAbip is higher than if he makes an out any other way. Correct?
No, that’s not right Craig. For the purposes of BABIP a strikeout isn’t considered at all. It is strictly a measure of how many balls put into play drop in for hits.
The intent is to measure factors like the effectiveness of the defense behind a pitcher, or to give clues of statistical abberation for a hitter.
See bunting him over to third was very stupid. Gardy, if you think one run is gonna win this game, you have another thing coming.
Jason Kubel,
if Ron Coomer can be an all star, you sure can!
As a hitter, if you make ten outs by grounding out, you will have a lower BAbip than if you make ten outs by striking out. That is, if everything else is equal. Correct?
Bunting is pretty much almost always stupid.
Austin, maybe we’ll see a pitching duel…………..probably not I guess.
Gendo, I just don’t like giving up that out with Casilla when he had 3 hits last night. Sure you are expecting to get one, but like I said are you expecting one run to win this game? I sure hope not. That is compounded by the fact that Mauer K’s and they end up not scoring at all.
I agree completely, Austin. You don’t want to take the bat out of Casilla’s hands and you don’t want to sacrafice outs.
GENDO:
Your 6:14 reminded me of what Jim Abbot, the one armed pitcher for the Angels used to say. “Go ahead and bunt on me, I always get them out anyway.”
I think Gardy is afraid of playing at Yankee Stadium as well.
Leadoff walks will kill you. C’mon Slowey.
Bring back Bombo and bat him 9th.
Nicely done by Slowey after the leadoff walk though!
A strikeout is considered, otherwise it wouldn’t be part of the formula.
BAbip tries to eliminate the negative impact of the strikeout, by factoring it out in a mathematical equation. Problem is it’s still there, in reality. Pretending the K isn’t important, won’t keep it from losing the game for you.
The bunt was a large part of what made Ty Cobb, the greatest player to ever play the game. A bunt is one of the smartest plays in the game.
The strikeout is the dumbest play in baseball that a hitter can make. Total, complete, unequivocal failure.
There was a time a batter would hang his head in shame, after a strikeout. He still should.
LNP, go back on the DL.
CRAIG:
So you’re saying the formula should have a disclaimer like “Past Performance is No Guarantee of Future Results”?
I am about ready to drive to NYC and ring Kay’s neck
It continues to amaze me that Yankees fans like Jeter more than ARod.
Didja see Casilla’s first AB last night? (A perfect stick hit) He’s hitting like a battle-title winner.
And Grandpa-Jones Gardy takes the bat out of his hand.
Ridiculous, especially the 1st inning. I thought putting the speedsters on base at the same time was something that turned Gardy on.
There isn’t anyone in the world who can figure this one out.
Correct Austin?
mike it is all about what have you done for me in October
romer, you know I can’t figure it out.
Jeter is a “True Yankee” whatever that means.
He will be playing 1B sometime next year i’d predict
how bout just taking gomez out of the lineup period
Okay…..that’s 3 crappy bunts so far by 3 Twins players —- once through the lineup.
CRAIG:
So you’re saying the formula should have a disclaimer like “Past Performance is No Guarantee of Future Results”?
No, I’m saying the equation should have a disclaimer like, “This formula makes baseballs worst whiffmeisters look good”.
Gomez’s demotions have to come in subtle steps so his confidence isn’t shattered. By September 15 he should be out of the lineup.
309 .377 .469 - Jeter
279 .361 .483 - ARod
Umm, those are nearly identical lines.
But, facts would be too much for most fans to use….
MIKE WANTS WINS:
Liking Jeter may have something to do with Alex’s reputation. “Stray-Rod” they call him. His favorite stripper broke her silence about the Yankee slugger this week. Her scouting report said he’s some kind of stud muffin, and Madonna is lucky.
Liriano:
3 IP 1 H 6 Ks 0 R 44 pitches
I hope Liriano is up soon. He’s clearly their best pitcher.
A team cane live with a # 9 hitter who hits .240 as long as he plays good D and is productive (as in steal a base, can go 1st to 3rd on a single etc…) when he does get on base. He is only 22 so we should cut him some slack, there are alot of .240 hitting number 9 hitters in baseball, the issue should be why have the Twins waited so long to move him down.
Here the blog reads so cordially tonight and I couldn’t figure out why at first. Just noticed that ‘T’ isn’t here critiquing and berating everything everyone says so that probably explains it. He probably has a volleyball game and didn’t think he had to share with everyone for once the time and location of it.
Shawn, do you have live boxscore or gameday to follow along with?
he is only the 6th best pitcher… that’s why he is in AAA 
Someone actually said Punto is the backbone of the team! He’s a backup infielder at best on any playoff contending team, a late inning defensive substitution. Also people like Kubel cause he can actually hit a home run, something you need more than one player on team to be able to do. And finally Gardy did what we all knew was right. It does make u wonder what he’s thinking to keep delaying the inevitable with Gomez. His worst move since DHing Tyner in the ‘06 Oakland series.
“Gomez’s demotions have to come in subtle steps so his confidence isn’t shattered. By September 15 he should be out of the lineup.”
Ha!
Thank you sir.
“cmathewson says:
July 22nd, 2008 at 5:58 pm
‘I’m a clueless dumbass’
Don’t beat yourself up. You’re not a dumbass.”
My thoughts exactly.
I went bloggily ballistic because I’m tired of people taking shots at Kubel (and there’ve been LOTS of them) these past months…….and proof is in the pudding.
FSN showed a replay of a game Liriano pitched. My first impression was he’s not major league ready at this time. It was hard to tell, I think his team 10-runned the other team in that game.
at least not many are calling for Kubel to be DFA anymore
There’s that damned Kubel!
:)>
since new york is all about winning the world series, maybe jeter’s popularity has more than a little to do with the yankees winning the world series in four of his first five years, including his rookie-of-the-year season of 1996? and a-rod has won none — with the yankees or anybody else?
T isn’t here because he’s been defending Gardy all this while for not moving Gomez to nineth. Dare we say, the man is finally speechless.
A guy i work with saw Liriano pitch in June. He doesn’t know much about baseball but could tell even then that Frankie was a man amoung boys. Was one of Liriano’s decent June games before the 2 game hiccup.
Get used to seeing Morneau walked to get to Kubel because it’s going to happen a lot.
Kay wants to follow Bert with a Circle Me Kay
sponsered by Circle K
mike wants wins says,
309 .377 .469 - Jeter
279 .361 .483 - ARod
Is that career numbers or as yankees? No big deal to me, but mlb.com shows these career stats :
AVG OBP SLG RBI
Jeter .316 .386 .459 977 ARod .307 .389 .579 1562
Interesting comparison, nonetheless…
Regarding world series, “and a-rod has won none — with the yankees or anybody else?”
And his WS performance has been lackluster, especially for the best offensive player in MLB.
i know romer, Arod has been so bad in the WS he hasn’t even played in a game
nevertheless, it’s pretty easy to see why ny loves jeter. and a-rod, um, not so much.
i have to live in NY, I hate em both
Those are their post season stats, which is always the Jeter argument. The regular season stats are sooooo in favor of ARod it isn’t even funny.
Umm, no, if you look at the stats I posted, ARod and Jeter have basically the same stats in the post season.
Liriano:
4 IP 1 H 1 BB 0 R 6 Ks 56 pitches
I wonder if Alex Rodriguez performance will be hurt, knowing he will give up most of his fortune, to the trashy broad he married.
Shawn, thanks.
So, his lackluster post-season performance is the reason why.
Didja all just hear that he’s flirting with going into show biz ’cause he just signed with the William Morris Agency?
Maybe he could do a harvest special for MTV in October. (You know, harvesting chicks…………you all come up with with a better theme.)
Texas got a couple of hits off White Sox’ Bhuerle in the first, but still 0-0.
Good one romer. Maybe a reality show with Madonna. “Scoring With The Stars”
Only 380 feet for Delmon on that one to center.
craig, infinite fortune minus most of infinite fortune is still infinite fortune.
romer,
the reason Jeter is popular is the World Series, the perceived clutchiness, as well as the fact that he tries to keep his personal life and problems to himself. Essentially he is considered, quiet, classy, and clutch.
Anyone who played on the 96-01 era Yanks is revered… excpet Clemens now.
Arod never won for the Yanks and his personal life is so puplic.
god i hate them so much, i need to move.
This is the Yanks worst starter, we need to beat this guy.
Seriously, if he’s already pondering post-MLB career possibility, then the Aaron/Bonds HR records may no longer be threatened by him.
Where’s Dennis Martinez when you need him….
The Yankees could send a little leaguer out there and the Twins would look just as good at the plate as they are tonight.
Why does this game seem so oddly familiar to Minnesota Twins playoff appearances this decade?
Michael Kay on YES just can’t get over how terrible a decision it was to have Casilla sac bunt in the first, so sick of this guy. Al Leiter attempted to calm him down but he just wasn’t having any of it…
Livan is our worst starter and a worse ERA then Rasner and has 10 wins…
Even worse pitchers on a staff can have a good game.
“…and his personal life is so puplic.”
pubic?
peutric?
hat-trick?
Or the Twins hitters are in a slump…it happens. Twins are still in the top 5 in runs scored i think.
“Michael Kay on YES just can’t get over how terrible a decision it was to have Casilla sac bunt…”
A broken clock twice a day………
kinda funny — gomez leading off in two of the first six innings.
“bloggies what the hell is ops sounds like a stat for loosers to look at and think they have a good player. stats that matter for batting OBS and Batting average what the hell is ops seriously”
Haha…….someone has probably already responded to this moronic comment. The only things that matter are “OBP” and batting average huh? Well OPS is those two added together. Maybe you could have taken half a second to Google it!
WOW!
RUN IT, GOMEZ!!!!
Excuse me, OBP and SLUG.
OPS matters
That will work!
“RUN IT, GOMEZ!!!!”
I am so glad that Gardy did not bunt there. It might not always be pretty, but see what happens when you have speed at the plate. He also had speed, but not a power threat to the deep OF on deck.
sorry, my MN spelling is as bad as Bert’s CA Math
Now here is a case where I wouldn’t mind them bunting but Casilla can’t get it down.
Even better yet than the bunt though, a base knock by Casilla! C’mon Joe you are due.
Like I said, a broken clock twice a day….
Liriano:
5 IP 1 H 1 BB 0 R 8 K 67 pitches
what the hell is obs?
No-no-no.
No bunts for Casilla. I trust his bat more than any Twin tonight. (Did you see that dweeby strikeout by Mauer in the 1st?)
I looked it up, it stands for obstruction. Learn something new every day, thanks AJ!
“5 IP 1 H 1 BB 0 R 8 K 67 pitches”
I’m beginning to like that Blackburn-to-the-BP suggestion more and more.
Kubel, c’mon you are due!
LNP isn’t up, no need to worry about the DP ball
How ’bout yet another granny for Kubel?
need more Kubel!
Great hustle by Kubel there.
When did Giambi learn how to field?
Gotta be the stache…
awe darn a close call goes against the Spankees
If Giambi didn’t have that pornstache it would have been a double play.
“sorry, my MN spelling is as bad as Bert’s CA Math”
Please don’t be sorry about your spelling, Shawn.
Consider it a Freudian typo.
Love it —- pubic!
Man, that is a Ron Jeremy-esque stache!Atta way Kubes!
Morneau needs protection.
I don’t think Morneau is going to get any good pitches to hit until some time this weekend.
Almost Delmon. Damn!
WILLIE:
Pornos call a double play a “Menage a trois” I think.
Well, if this baseball gig doesn’t work out for “Dirk” Giambi I hear they’re making a remake of “Boogie Nights.” He will be employed.
I liked Giambi’s ’stache earlier in the season when it looked like he just chugged a quart of chocolate milk.
So does everybody leave Slowey in for the 6th? I saw leave him in until a runner reaches and if that is the case then he gets the hook.
“Morneau needs protection.”
Now why did that, falling in the sequence where it did, make me laugh?
Only 2 strikeouts for Twins tonight are Punto and Mauer. Just about identical BA’s too.
This is a dangerous inning.
I bet A-Rod can get Dirk into show biz.
right romer. punto needs protection also.
The Yankees have 3 hits now. I’d keep Slowey in.
Austin, Guerrier didn’t look sharp last night. Who’s got a better chance than Slowey to face the fearsome five?
It’s not like Slowey’s pitch count is high, right?
Damon is 13-19 stealing.
Austin, I wonder if Crain has found his lost slider yet.
i hate the Yankees
nice cookie kev
Well, I was wrong.
LNP has to get that ball
Slowey hates pitching with a lead.
Dennys Reyes gets to face Jason Jiggler’s Boogie Night.
and I was just thinkin things were AOK for a moment
I guess Kevin doesn’t want to get a win today.
Liriano:
6 IP 1 H 1 BB 9 Ks 0 R 80 pitches
Sigh… at least it’s not a blowout tonight. Not worried yet.
And on a positive note…
Liriano:
6IP, 1H, 0R, 1BB, 9K, 80 pitches (50 strikes)
Giambi looks more Harry Reams-ish than the Hedgehog IMO.
The problem with Slowey is he has only 1 real good pitch, his cut fastball. He uses it over and over again. It produces lots of foul balls and a high pitch count. I think he is the best candidate for the pen while he works on developing another good pitch he can throw anytime. His fastball is very effective the first couple times through.
Maybe he is moving to the pen to provide much needed help and the Cisco kid will fill his spot.
Mauer is a gifted and wonderful catcher, but I wonder if his natural nice-guyness prevents him from calling the strong inside pitch.
Abreu’s right elbow was past the centerline of home plate…put the ball in his ear or ribs. All it takes is once. But the catcher has to initiate that with this bunch of pitchers…there isn’t a nasty a##hole in the bunch so the catcher has to do it.
The Yankees need to be punched in the nose. Slowey’s out anyway so this would have been a good spot to go inside deep. Gardy needs to tell this staff that that , too, is respecting the game and playing the right way and doing the little things. Hall of Fame pitchers made it there by making it uncomfortable for the batter. Go ahead, hit some of those effing Yankee SOB’s.
probably should wait ’till a home game for that Willie.
I can see moving Slowey to the pen. Why would he neccessarily have to fail in order to make the move? Why can’t it just be that Liriano is simply a better pitcher and thus deserves the starts?
Why? We’re trying to win this one.
My high school coach, an old redneck SOB who chewed Red Man used to tell the pitchers to draw a line from his front elbow to the plate. If it’s inside the edge of the plate then throw it at his hip. Worked most of the time.
Sweat has not been very effective lately
I woulda plunked Abreu and walked ARod.
Starting a bean-ball war in Yankee Stadium=not smart
Why?
Just out of curiosity, how would people here rank the pitchers in our rotation? (Well, the young ones anyway… I’m assuming we can mostly agree on Livan being 5th in terms of talent)
I’d say: Baker, Slowey, Perkins, Blackburn, Livan… though I think Blackburn and Perkins are pretty close based on what we’ve seen this year so far.
I wouldn’t be opposed to Gardenhire and Smith telling Glen or Nick that they’re going to be pitching out of the bullpen for the rest of the year, in order to make room for Liriano, but that they’ll have a spot in next year’s rotation.
I think I’d most like to see Perkins go there, however, just because his injury history is more worrisome, and it adds another lefty out of the bullpen. Letting him pitch there could get him around 140-150 innings this year, and be a nice bridge to working him towards 200 for next season, assuming he can remain healthy/effective.
any takers on this bet? Slowey to the pen and Lirano to the rotation…may even move blackburn back with teh day off to split Liriano and Perkins up.
That is my guess and I am sticking to it.
Starting a bean-ball war in Yankee Stadium isn’t smart but effectively pitching inside would be highly appreciated. These jerks are all over the plate.
Ponson plunked Young last night, almost plunked Span. It’s already started.
It’s just that Mauer chooses to not continue (like Willie Norwood says).
If you took all the Yankees players and put them in different uniforms and played somewhere other than Yankee Stadium and we would win a lot more games than we do against them. I swear when the Twins get to New York, they are just awestruck. And I hate them Damn Yankees!!!
Bring in Crain to face the dangerous Chad Moeller. Brilliant!
I’m only seeing this on Gameday. What the heck was with the Cano at bat? Gameday shows a foul, then two balls. All three right down the pipe. Is Gameday off that much? Or was that a special Yankee strike zone? Just wondering if anyone who was watching saw something different than Gameday.
again I say does everyone think our young starters are so good 1 can’t be traded to get Beltre??
this kids look great against the Royals and Tiggers of the World against red Sox and Yanks it’s the same old story for the Twins.. Baker is the one pitcher that steps up against Yanks.. too bad he doesn’t get his chance…
Span at leadoff Gomez is 9th.. looks good so far…
i think they should send Blackie or Perkins to the pen due to their higher innings and the fact they have never thrown 200.
as far as starter rank:
Baker
Slowey
Blackie
Perkins
Livan
Liriano would probably slot at #2
I agree with your pitching rankings, Steve. But it’s a close one between Slowey and Perk because Perk pitches inside.
Actually it’s damned close among the 3 of Slowey/Perk/Blackie.
Shawn, I don’t necessarily disagree, but I think Slowey would be real good in the 8th inning. He just isn’t going far enough in games right now and needs another + pitch. Again, Slowey talent wise is probably top 3 in the rotation.
Same thing has happened, for some reason, with the Rangers.
I’m not advocating multiple hits but you have to pitch inside and command that half of the plate. The Twins try to expand the outside first, which, to me is nonsense. It is way easier to get the outside if you move the guy off the plate..at least his eyes. Force him to look for the inside pitch and you don’t have to go two inches off the outside.
Anderson is a very good mechanical pitching coach. I’m not convinced his philosophy is up to snuff. There are two sides of the plate.
I’ve talked to Bert about this and, as you’ve heard on the broadcasts, he thinks the Twins live too much on the outer half. So do I. If you pitch inside and hit the guy so what? You get warned and the other team’s guy gets tossed if he retaliates. Be the aggressor.
More good news! I see Carmona is pitching against us this weekend.
Buscher is coming back to earth.
I’d rather trade for Casey Blake than Beltre.
I rank them:
Baker
Liriano
Perkins
Slowey
Blackburn
Slowey and Blackburn don’t have a way to blow away a hitter, they need incredible control, the rest of the starters have better natural stuff they can work through a game even when their control is not pin point
probable final line Liriano:
7 IP 2 H 2 BB 10 K 0 R 99 pitches
perkins can go, you all are biased based on that start last night. He was working on a great ERA this year and he has less total time in the majors than any of those other guys. Blackburn is def more talented than Perkins and I even trust him more than Slowey at this point. It was like the first start for the guy at Yankee Stadium, give him a break. Liriano/Baker/Blackburn are going to be a big part of this team the next few years.
Fire,
It all depends on the other prospect(s) they want in return. If they wanted a Blanton-esque deal (which looks real good for the Phils so far in his debut tonight… ha), then they’re likely asking for one of the four as well as another top prospect, probably someone who can play third base for them in the future, which makes me think of Luke Hughes and his .328/.396/.589 line in New Britain.
That’s two guys who could be a massive part of the future here. I’m all for Beltre, but it depends on the price. I wouldn’t be irate or anything to see that trade, but I also understand the Twins’ logic in backing off a bit.
Justin, I do agree with you on Blackburn…it was just a bad start…which happens.
I’m sick of the “overwhelmed by Yankee Stadium” excuse. The Twins have been going with that for years, young pitchers or not.
“probable final line Liriano:”
Yup, what else can he do at AAA!!?
Slowey would be worth the most in a trade due to his higher prospect status
I think Slowey has the most upside. As soon as he learns one pitch that is significantly slower than his others he will dominate, or close too it. There is not enough separation in velocity between his fastball and his slowest pitch. Perkins already has realized he may have the same issue and he is working on a new slider. If Slowey can come up with a better change he probably will be really good.
Blackburn is the one that, to me, doesn’t have the full array. If the sinker ain’t sinking he has some trouble. A little too Silva-like for me…he would be the centerpiece to get Beltre in my world.
How about a little mental toughness out of the pitching staff?
Oh good, a walk to the #9 hitter. Due up next - Mantle, DiMaggio, Ruth.
game over
Can someone tell Gardy not to scare the crap out of his own team when they go to Yankee Stadium.
Jeter’s giving me Punto flashbacks to 2007… the horror! THE HORROR!
Part of the problem in my opinion is Boof. The Twins do not know what to do with him. They are unwilling to send him down and thus loose him via waivers. I personally don’t care if we lose him to waivers but the Twins aren’t.
wow… sure would’ve been nice to have gotten that called strike three…
Jeter took a pitch that was strike three, and it is not called, and then hits a double for 2 runs. Yankee Stadium gift by McClellan, the ump.
That 2 strike pitch to Jeter was not a strike.
Only a half hour until Frasier is on.
Goodness our relief pitchers are fine but not against the Yankees ad Red Sox then they are horrible.
The 2 strike pitch sure looked like a strike to me–I guess McClellan saw it as being high. Looked below the letters to me.
Although it would be nice to get another slugger, it would be hard to give up another young pitcher considering Livan won’t be back, we already gave up Garza, and Boof looks terrible. I’m all for bringing up Liriano, and as Steve said Perkins could add another Lefty to the pen. Cause knowing the Twins they won’t take away Livans starts. But that doesn’t solve our everlong lack of power.
In a total act of self defiance and as way to loosen up this team at yankee stadium…Naked BP needs to walk on to the field and leave a steaming pile on home plate…once Abreau hit that homer, did any of us feel the twins could come back?
I’m so tired of the Twins’ inability to solve the Yankees. Time to deal for Beltre. In a game like this you see how Buscher is liability at 3rd - he’ll probably grow up to be a Cuddy-type hot-and-cold player, but in big-game situations he just can’t be counted on to make the routine plays.
Sometimes ya have to state the obvious, so……
The Twins haven’t scored very many runs in the first 16 innings of this series. And the Yankees are a potent offense.
Even if our pitching was much better so far, still hard to beat the Yanks with just a few runs in a couple games.
Complain all you want about the umps, folks. Simple fact is Gardenhire & Co. can’t win the big games. They cower and collapse like frightened kittens against the Yankees, Red Sox and, of course, in the post-season. Naturally, that gets Gardenhire lifetime employment in Minnesota — a state where mediocrity is always good enough.
The Twins were still in it until Crain walked the #9 hitter - Hank Whatshisname.
Well now we will have the same record as the Yankees….YIPPEE!
To those comparing Blackburn and Slowey,Blackburn has been much more consistant this year.Blackburn has 12 quality starts in 20 games,Slowey has just six in 15 games.I’m not sold on Sloweys “upside”.Three of his quality starts have come against KC,Washington,and San Diego.Three of the most offensively challenged teams in MLB.Blackburn has more velocity,but needs to immprove,IMO, on handling adversity.
Either way its time to bring up Liriano.Given the fact that the Twins seem set on staying with Livan Hernandez,I’d vote for Slowey to the pen,and DFAing either Boof or Bass.Slowey,if he is as talented as many here think,will have a rotation spot waiting for him to earn it next year.
there goes nickie… jump throw on an easy play
You guys are getting outclassed in the Bronx again
Looking ahead we have Mussina, Lee, and then Carmona. There may not be many runs in the near future.
I think the Twins may want to rethink the Beltre deal. Slowey,Buscher and a minor league pitcher for Beltre we really need to add some right handed pop. Bring up Liriano and give them hell.
Nickie should head over across to the Upper West Side and Lincoln Center. I hear the NYC Ballet is looking for a new lead. His jete is sublime.
I’ve never seen a defender who spends more time with his spikes off the ground. But he is a great defender.
Well we are in a rebuilding year…lol
If we trade one of the young starters what are we thinking for a 5th starter next year? That is assuming Livan is not with us anymore!
The difference between the Twins and the Yankees,Red Sox,White Sox if a pitcher makes a mistake to most of their hitters it ends up in the seats if their pitcher makes a mistake to most of are hitters it ends up a 2 hopper to 2nd base.
We’ll see what happens in the dome.
Jay,
I hear ya and I am sick and tired of it…
and there is Liriano pitching a 2 hitter in 7 innings striking out 10 tonight… And people like Bass are in the majors… Why?????
We have alot of pitcher in the minors
The difference in records though–not much.
David,
Buscher and a minor league pitcher won’t be enough to be enough in addition to one of the four starters.
Besides, given Slowey’s minor league numbers last year, and his complete dominance of Milwaukee on two different occasions this year, I don’t think he’s going anywhere.
I’d bet on Perkins or Blackburn going, but it’d take a better second player than Buscher.
I just get so sick of losing to these teams…I think they will rebound but maybe not until we get to Cleveland. If we make the playoffs these are the teams we will have to face…frustrating!
The Mariners wouldn’t want Buscher. He’s a banjo hitter whose best position is DH.
This team has a couple of potential stars in Morneau and Mauer a solid 2nd baseman in Casilla, projects in Gomez Span and the lackidazical Delmon Young playing aside a bunch of patchwork players, they need a shortstop and third baseman badly. Busher and punto are cute backups on a solid team. Gomez isn’t ready yet and the pitching staff isn’t ready for the bigtime brightlight games just yet.
Anyhow, I’m off the computer for the night I believe.
Have a good night all… let’s pray for a miracle from the Twins.
So does anyone actually seeing us cutting ties with Boof/Bass? Ultimately unless we trade a starter or an injury occurs how are we getting Liriano up here?
Thrylos98, it’s the same reason that Santana spent half his peak years in the bullpen and stiffs like Hernandez are continually marched to the mound to get lit up. Sheer obstanance, blind allegiance to veterans and the firm knowledge that his job is secure for life no matter how often his team collapses when it counts.
Boof might still have a little trade value. Bass should be placed on waivers and I wouldn’t be surprised if he cleared.
Rangers stink. They can’t get any runs off Buehrle, 6-0 White Sox in the Seventh.
I know it sucks to be embarrassed two games in a row (3 24 hours from now) but Denard was a great leadoff hitter today!
the lackidazical Delmon Young
sorry, but have you checked Delmon’s numbers vs. Mr Cuddyer lately? The guy is 22. Give him a break…
Is that Luis Castillo playing RF for us? Gets on 1b, can’t steal, not dynamic, never scores. OBP rocks. I sure hope GoGo finds his MoJo again.
Has Cuddyer played this year:)?
I generally defend Gardy, but I have to agree he manages not to lose in big games. 2 nights in a row - 2 stupid sac bunts. Last night, Twins down 2 with 2 on and only in 2nd inning, he tries to sac with Harris to get to Span and Gomez!! OK - best case scenario - the Yankees don’t pitch around Span and he gets a basehit - now we’re tied at 2. The Yankees only have 8 more innings to score. Harris has 1 failed bunt attempt, then what do you know, he gets a hit. Tonight, 1st inning, we play for 1 stinkin run - playing a hot team in their own ballpark - by bunting with one of our hottest hitters. Any wonder they look tight? The tone has been set at the top. And unfortunately, that has been true for most of Gardy’s postseason games as well.
Steve,
All of our young pitcher have shown signs of greatness but 1 will have to go I would keep Perkins because he is a lefty, and I think Blackburn has a little better stuff than Slowey, the big park in Seattle would help Slowey, Buscher is a good player not great, but Seattle is in bad shape I would be willing to add another minor league guy if needed. But sad as it is to say I think the only move the Twins will make is to cut Bass and bring up Liriano and hope we can bunch up enough singles to score.
I would say Bass has been better than Boof!
Twins problem same as every year HR. But we already traded a top pitching prospect for a hitter dyoung. didn’t work. Simple solution Free Agency$$$.
Im talking about his approach to defense and how slow the guy is in the field going after the ball when its in play, it looks like he’s playing with arthritis.
I don’t get all the hate on Delmon.
Until the Twins learn how to win in Yankee Stadium, there is no reason for them to get into the playoffs. If the goal is to only get to the playoffs with another one and done series, then go for it. But the Twins are 3-18 since the beginning of 2002 in Yankee Stadium and it is getting quite embarassing for them.
No hate, just no power
I don’t hate Delmon it would just be nice to see him show a little more energy on defense. Also i think the Twins would have to include Span and a starter even to get the trade going for Beltre, to get a 29yr old gold glove 3rd baseman with power should be the top priority for the twins after we funded a new stadium for the 90yr old billionare owner.
it’s so simple. just add adrian beltre and his .776 ops (94th best in the majors; his slugging percent ranks 87th) at roughly $16 million for the rest of this year and next. the twins will never lose to the yankees or red sox again.
romer im back i started the kubel thing if u dont remember I stated he was the most overated player but now i have changed my mind to No-Go
gomez has one good thing in his game and thats speed. his defense is solid, but he is really overated when he gets one base he’s electric but the big question is when does he get on base
enlighten me romer with gomez’s OPS
Sometimes a change of scenery is all it takes to get your game back on track, he’s playing for a horrible team thats going nowhere and i would take Beltre the current third baseman any day of the week.
And back… guess I was lying about leaving.
Anyone else watch the press conference with Gardenhire, and how he laughed at the concept of Span leading off being a difference-maker at all? Not only that, but he said, “Gomez led off just as many innings as the other guy anyway…”
“The other guy”? Come on Gardy, I’m not much of a Span fan yet, but how many of your young players are you going to disrespect?
I wish I’d gotten to see someone ask about “that guy in Triple-A” and his outing tonight, to see what Gardy had to say about that.
The whole conference was just Ron repeating, “They’re a good club. This is a hard place to play.”
Not a thrilling amount of insight…
beltre at a reasonable price is a good idea. beltre for several solid prospects and/or major league talent plus roughly $16 million for 1-1/3 years? not such a good idea.
steve from fridley, i don’t mean to be sarcastic, but what did you expect gardy to say? what should he have said? what COULD he have said?
after all, it was gomez, leading off an inning, that ignited the only twins rally of the night.
I’m not bothering to read the comments from during the game, so excuse me if I’m repeating what someone else has said… but this game was over in the top of the first inning.
Span is on 2nd base… nobody out.. against the Yankees… and the Twins FRIGGING BUNT!
You do NOT give up an out… from a hitter batting .320… in the top of the first inning… against the frigging Yankees.
That just epitomizes the pansie-assed approach of Gardy and the Twins in NY. I simply do not understand why they’re so damn scared to play ball in that place.
No Mas! 3-18 at Yankee Stadium. At least the Twins were competitive for 2 of the 3 games at Fenway.
The Twins NEED to bring up Liriano. He is completely dominating. Enough is enough
Mr.romer, As someone who appreciates your input, disregard the taunts. That said, fortunately the Twins are going to CLE next where the world famous Cleveland Clinic is ranked at the top in heart surgery, particularly, transplants. Thereafter, they can divert the charter flight from MSP to Rochester, whereby the fine neurosurgeons can performs brain surgery on both the FO, team coaches and 25 players. And, if the league rules will allow compliance, the entire organization can receive massive testosterone shots upon their arrival in the Twin Cities, thereby assuring the fans of their ability and physical qualifications to, at least, match the fight, drive and foresight of the bloggers on this and other esteemed sites.
Mr . Crickett, I could not agree more. When they bunted Span to third and Mauer vapor-locked, the games was over. Please no defense motions!
jimcrikket you’re crazy. any manager will play for the first run on the road, so calling the bunt was justified. mauer and morneau were coming up and there aren’t many days when they won’t get that run in.
ROFL… playing one friggin run? Against the Yankees? Yeah right. There’s exactly ONE manager who would do that… and he was in the visitors’ dugout tonight. I like the guy but he checks his spine at LaGuardia whenever the team lands in NYC. I have no clue why.
Where can I find a link with the line on Liriano tonight?
“Gomez led off just as many innings as the other guy anyway…”
Gardy isn’t disrespecting Span, it’s just a manner of speech.
Whether Gomez bats 1st or 9th isn’t as important as whether or not he should be in the major leagues at all. Problem is, the Twins don’t have anyone in the minors who is clearly better, to replace him with.
LEN has a link to milb.com’s site below. Liriano went 7 innings. 0 runs. 2 hits. 2 BB. 10 Ks. Rochester won 13-0.
That 1st inning bunt wasn’t clearly the wrong play. Casilla is a pretty good hitter, so I think you let him hit. Bunting him over is also okay. I think it’s just a judgement call. If Mauer had put the ball in play, Span would have scored. Mauer usually does that.
Oh… and Cisco threw 99 pitches, 61 for strikes, in those 7 innings.
send gomez down and bring up revere im somewhat being sarcastic but the AAA team is a joke the best hitting outfielder in the minors is revere
Well spoken, Jim. Playing for one run against the Yankees, especially at Yankee Stadium, is a poor strategy.
Gardy was quick to blame the bullpen for the loss but the fact is that you’re not going to win many against the Yankees if you only score 2 runs.
“In the moment, you feel the frustration,” Gomez said. “But when you go to the hotel room and talk to yourself, you say you’re going to be OK. I tell myself, ‘You are a superstar, don’t worry about it. You’ll be all right.’ - Gomez regarding his recent struggles hitting.
“You are a superstar, don’t worry about it.”
I love this guy, even if he can’t hit. He’s one of a kind.
that’s pretty funny, craig. i think i’m gonna start using that one for my own self.
Me Craig, Ditto. At least Gomez is not vanilla. He may be a lot of things, but he is not easily repressed nor subdued. And for that, I can’t help but like the guy and eagerly await his stardom. We can omly hope to be so positive.
some people are born to greatness and others have it thrust upon them.
then there’s carlos gomez, who has apparently thrust it upon himself.
I have no problem with Gomez’ doing whatever it takes to keep up his self confidence. No athlete can succeed without that belief in himself.
I also wouldn’t bet against him being right some day.
hi jimc, i sure don’t mean to imply that i’m pulling against gomez. either way, it’ll be fun to watch. but it’ll be a lot more fun if he really is as good as he thinks.
he is… entertaining… to say the least.
you know what? i’m a couple time zones away and never even seen the kid except on a few gameday clips.
but it’s almost like the old days from across the country. you didn’t need to live in boston or own a tv to know ted williams had something special.
MR. Crickett and MM, Who knows what will develop with young Master Carlos. At least, he has the stones to stay, play, and fight. Something, sadly, that could be learned from people with much more experience and making a heck of a lot more money. Reminds me of a guy, at least in spirit, who wore a number twelve points higher. Irrepressiblility (sp?) is not a common trait.
Oops, please read by people and not from people in my last screed. Sorry..
It seems to me the young Twins are just intimidated by the Yankees. Maybe natural when you see how mature they are.
i saw slowey on a gameday clip for the first time the other day. looked very young. as, of course, does baker.
it’s almost like usa vs ussr hockey, circa 1979. almost.
I was wondering about a possible trade for Brett Myers. He throws gas and could step right in as a late setup man for us. We obviously need the help there and everyone says he is better suited for the bullpen, than as as a starter like he will tonight for the Phillies. Also, I hear the Phillies will throw cash into the trade to help eat some of his $12 million contract for the next two year. He would be an instant help to the bullpen.
Mickey, I’m a couple of time zones away also but fortunately have seen Go-Go on TV at least. I’ve said from Day 1, he’s damn exciting to watch and damn entertaining whether his play is good, bad, or ugly. A friend who has seen him in person at the Dome confirms how exciting he is to watch. As for the young rotation, they all look young, real young.
I’ve also said over and over that the Twins need attitude. Gomez has plenty of it and so does Liriano in a more quiet way. After all he faced down Mr. Clemens himself on national TV in ‘06. What a great attitude from Go-Go and Gardy is worried about breaking his spirit??? Viva dos Dominicanos.
BTW I don’t know whose idea it was to bunt with Span already in scoring position in the top of the 1st but it immediately gave me that sinking feeling of uh-oh here we go again. One run MAYBE when Yanks can get more than that with one swing of a bat. Monday’s game was embarrassing but Tuesday’s might have even been worse with the boys committing more boo-boos including everyone’s “favorite” LNP! And what’s with the M&M? You’d think they’d have real positive thoughts about hitting well after spending an entire evening and half the night there last week in a winning effort.
Do any of you minor league savants know who the Twins’ equivalent prospect to the DBacks Bonifacio would be?
That was the cost to get reliever Jon Rausch from the Nats.
I believe ESPN called him the Snakes’ #6 prospect. Who would that be in our world? On the surface it seems like a great deal because Rausch is inked until 2010. Would have provided a measure of protection should Neshek not return quickly or as effectively.
Actually I see that Rauch’s contract also contains a club option for the 2010 season. This would have been an interesting move for the Twins. C’mon Billy! Shed those Terry Ryan turtle chromosomes.
Next month, the Twins start a stretch where they play 20 out of 24 games on the road. That will be really tough and it wouldn’t surprise me if they started to sink in the standings during that time. I can’t wait to see the posts on this blog then
“the Twins’ equivalent prospect to the DBacks Bonifacio would be?”
Toby Gardenhire
Casilla makes game changing error Monday night: “He’s nervous.”
Punto makes game changing error Tuesday night: “GET THE PITCHFORKS!”
Consistency seems to be a problem around these parts. 
T would Punto be a good fit at SS tonight. Like I said before I don’t personally dislike Punto. It is all the other blog citizen’s
why does gomez not bat 8th and punto bat 9th with all that grit….
span
castilla
Mauer
Morneau
Kubel
Young
Busher
Gomez
Harris
Punto is hot..play him again
I would bat Gomez 8th when Punto is in the lineup. They both have turn the lineup over speed, but Gomez has a little more power.
