Midday update - with an update
Posted on December 9th, 2008 – 1:00 PMBy La Velle
Just heard that Jorge Cantu doesn’t throw well because of some sort of shoulder issue. One person indicated that he’ll eventually need to transition over to first base. Don’t know how that affects things.
The annual GM meeting has just begun. Bill Smith was seen walking into the meeting room while talking with Yankees’ GM Brian Cashman.
Scott Miller of CBS,Sportsline.com reported that Scott Erickson is kicking around a comeback and has contacted the Twins. The Twins, by all indications, aren’t interested.
Joe Nathan has been spotted hanging out with Nick Punto here.
ESPN’s Jayson Stark is reporting that Casey Blake has agreed to a three-year deal with the Dodgers for $17.1 million or so. He writes that the Twins offered two years and $14 million. If that’s true, a third year at $3 million or so doesn’t sound that bad. But let’s make sure what the final numbers are because so baseball official told me last night it was three years and $21 million. Maybe it’s $3 with attainable incentives. Just speculating.
Everyone is waiting to one of three things to happen today: K-Rod signing with the Mets. Jake Peavy going to the Cubs and progress on the Mark Teixeira front. Many feel the meetings are being held up by those situations.
2:45 updates: One official with knowledge of the situation said there’s little chance the Rays and Twins craft a three-way deal involving Delmon Young.
Award for Gardy: Twins manager Ron Gardenhire has been named Baseball America’s Manager of the Year. BA will announce its 2008 award winners tonight.
More praise for Aaron Hicks: One BA staffer believes Aaron Hicks will be ranked very high in their top prospects list for 2009, which will be released around the start of the season.
Hunter-Agassi join forces: Torii Hunter appeared with tennis star Andre Agassi to announce his plans to provide 100 college scholarships from 2009-2012. Some of them will be awarded to students at Agassi’s charter school in las Vegas.
Agassi used an old but well-delivered line while talking about his school.
“Just because I’ve built a school doesn’t mean I know a lot about education,” he said. “Eighth grade was the best three years of my life.”
Hunter’s Heart of a Champion program, a charter education program for secondary students, is being used in 18 states. That includes roughtly 7,000 students in Anahiem, Minneapolis and Hunter’s hometown of Pine Bluff, Ark.
213 Responses to "Midday update - with an update"
I didn’t know that K-Rod could sing.
Shocking, the team with low payroll has payroll flexibility! Of course they do, they have said that nearly every year I’ve been a fan. Of course, they’ve almost never, ever acted that way. I put their offseason ability at signing guys in their prime earning years at the same ability as Tyner hitting a HR. He tried, but never succeeded.
Carrying this thought forward from the last thread…
Michael Young would look really nice in that lineup and if, as writers are saying, the Rangers are at least willing to listen, why not make a pitch for him?
They want young pitching, which the Twins have… and if it’s true the Twins have some payroll room, then they’re one of what would have to be very few teams that have room to absorb the salary AND a surplus in the area that the Rangers want in return.
Would be very uncharacteristic of the Twins to make that kind of splash, but one can always dream.
Doesn’t sound to me like Peavy going to the Cubs is going to happen any time soon, with their ownership situation up in the air, unless they can clear salary somehow first.
How much would Furcal cost? He’d be a great addition to our lineup.
Scott Erickson would fit the Twins FA signing pattern. At 40 years old (41 on 2/2/09) he certainly is old and washed up.
I was just reading that the Astros will not resign Randy Wolf until they can clear salary. I hope to heck that this doesn’t mean that salary will be Ty Wiggington. He is not going to be a huge upgrade on our offense or defense, and they will most likely want something decent for him. I mean Tampa wanted Garza for him and then settled on a mediocre releiver from the Stros…
K-Rod “singing” with the Mets?
Here’s Gardy singing at the Eagles:
The Mets are making a mistake on K-Rod!
Does it seem odd to anyone else here that Nathan is in Vegas hanging around with Punto? Guess LNP is everyone’s BFF so any team would be lucky to get him - please! Still wish the FO would go after JJ Hardy now that it looks like Escobar is off the table. Don’t know if it matters if we get a shortstop or 3rd baseman - we’re only going to get one and then will use Harris/Tolbert/Buscher to fill in at the other spot.
“He tried, but never succeeded.”
mike, I am assuming you are talking about Tyner not hitting a homerun. If so, I hate to break it to you, but he, well, kinda did… 2007 against the Indians, I believe… I remember it because I almost had a stroke…
AM
Furcal turnded down 3 years at 33 million and 4 years at 40 million reportedly.
Thank you JimCrikket - isn’t this the kind of thing we’re supposed to be able to do with the new ballpark? Isn’t that what we were sold? Why not AT LEAST kick the tires on Young?
Minnesotacat…
I just read on my phone that Doug Melvin plans on keeping both SS’s and I’ve also heard from friends in Milwaukee that they are pretty unhappy with Rickie Weeks, and if Escobar comes up this year he may get a look at 2nd base.
Rosenthal had it up on fox sports that the Rangers weren’t taking nibbles for Young seriously.
La Velle,
Is it possible that the Twins could go after a second baseman and move Casilla to short?
Young also has some sort of no-trade protection so you’d have to say it’s a long shot for anyone, never mind the Twins, to get the guy from the Rangers.
It’s just that there are so few SS/3B options out there that really get me excited and he would certainly be someone who would.
Your joking about Young right? Yes he’d be a perfect fit, but he’s just going into a 5 year/$80 million deal….we can’t afford him, Mauer and Morneau….not to mention our pitchers will start getting big raises now. Young is great but not at $15 million a year.
Not to mention he is 32 yrs “young”, not exactly the player you want to pay $15M a year for the next 5 years… this is what teams try to dump 2 years from now.
What’s going on witht he comment box? It keeps filling in other people’s information (names and email addresses) something is wrong and email addresses are being published!!!!!
As for the Tyner thing, yup, he did hit one, which I think is one more HR than the number of players the Twins have acquired in their prime earning years.
Sucks if that’s true about Cantu. Don’t think the Twins will be needing a 1B anytime soon…
$3mil for an additional year of blake isn’t that bad…but of course, the Twins are paying 3 mil this year for no year of Lamb.
And the last thing the Twins want is to start having “just another year” style contracts blocking guys like it did this year (Lamb, Everett, Monroe)
I still don’t get why the Dodgers suddenly upped their offer when the Twins pulled out. Did the Indians end up throwing their hat in the ring?
Though if that’s the case, I have a feeling the Dodgers would’ve ended up out/overbidding on Blake anyway.
I’m disappointed the Twins couldn’t land him, but it sounds like the Dodgers weren’t going to let him go easy.
Ole,
Carl Pohlad is the richest owner in MLB… He can afford to bring in CC, Texiera, K-Rod, and Manny and it wouldn’t hurt his wealth any.
The Twins are too cheap to pay 15 million for a SS. Now if they can maybe add a couple of minor league prospects to get the Rangers to kick in 25 million of that contract… then expect the Twins to try and get something done.
Pohlad pisses me off, but he rarely gets the worst end of a business deal.
which I think is one more HR than the number of players the Twins have acquired in their prime earning years.
Stewart and Nathan? To a lesser extent Castillo? Sure, Nathan wasn’t much of anything when the Twins got him…but he sure as heck wasn’t “young” and sure as heck wasn’t “washed-up”.
Scott Erickson????!!!!! Why would anyone listen let alone print that for other than a huge belly laugh. You’re laughing, too, right?
Morneau could play 3B, he’s got a great glove. Why not take a look at first baseman and see if it will be easier to plug a hole that way. Not saying it’s ideal, but it would be better than what we have.
Mike Lamb signs a one year deal with the Brewers.
First Everett, now Lamb…didn’t the Tigers and Brewers learn ANYTHING?
Morneau could play 3B, he’s got a great glove.
If it were that easy, Morneau would be at 3B, Cuddyer would be 1B, and the logjam in the OF would be resolved.
Except it’s hinging on Morneau playing a position I don’t believe he has ever played before.
Ken Rosenthal says he’s (Young)already been paid $20MM in bonus money from his new deal, leaving $60MM or so over five years (Heyman said something similar). But
If Morneau can be the third-string catcher, I bet he could play a decent third base. He’s just a great athlete. Plus, he has those goalie reflexes. Can he throw?
Mike Lamb is a much better player than he showed in his half-season with the Twins.
Morneau at 3B? You’re joking right. That actually made me laugh loud enough for other people at work to hear me.
Nathan was not in his prime earning years. They may have re-signed him, but they didn’t acquire him while he was highly paid. Stewart, maybe, but he had 6 months left on his contract, right? Castillo, maybe, I’d need to check on his contract status. So, maybe in 10+ years you can think of two guys acquired in their prime? They’ve been a DH or 3B or power hitting OFer away from being dominant this decade…..and not signed one from the outside that was making above/near the league average in salary. What if those teams from earlier this decade had signed a DH or 3B? How much farther would they have gone in the playoffs? We’ll never know, because the Twins don’t acquire guys in their prime earning years.
have I baited them enough?
Jake,
Morneau is not going to go to 3rd base.
On my MLB 08 game I made a trade with the Rangers for Michael Young…..Worked out well. I won the World Series! We’re comin!!!
Michael Young is already on the decline. Why would you trade for a player that has 5 years left on his deal and is declining. Also his defense at SS has declined big time. The Twins would be better off signing Furcal than trading for Young.
WJ,
“Mike Lamb is a much better player than he showed in his half-season with the Twins’
So is Everett.
What the Tigers and Brewers learned (from David Ortiz, JC Romero,Cristian Guzman and Kyle Lohse) is that the Twins sometimes discard perfectly useable players.
mike wants wins
Signing guys as free agents to big time contracts generally doesn’t work out. You’re better off trading for guys. How many of those big name FA’s that have signed 6+ year deals have been worth it the last 2 or 3 years? The percentage is pretty low.
sane,
Then again, every player hits that point where he is finished. Maybe Lamb hit his last season. Last year he was so off his usual numbers. Everett had shoulder issues but he was always a weak hitter, so there should have been no surprises there.
BC Beneke-There you go again,calling Pohlad cheap.We all know that’s the case.It’s not fair,but what the heck,life isn’t fair.You blame BS and then in the next breath you blame Pohlad.You can’t have it both ways!BS is forced to be more creative than he would have to be with another owner!
JC Romero was pretty awful when he was traded and it took him a couple of seasons (and teams) to rebound. Same with Lohse and Balfour. They were good last year but that was a couple years removed from when they were Twins. Releasing Ortiz cannot be defended on any grounds. At least we got Casilla for Romero.
Walter Johnson, Morneau is the 3rd string catcher because he was drafted as a catcher from high school, even though he did not catch a pitch in the minors… He never played 3B.
jama, which guys have they traded for that were proven and in their prime?
I’ve decided what I’d do. Sign Burrell to be DH. Put Kubel in right field and Span in left. Figure out how to turn Young and a pitcher into a SS or 3B or 2B (this being the weak point of the plan). Burrell is projected by James and others to have an OPS between Mauer and Morneau, and he’s right handed.
Do you all think just anybody can play 3rd base? That’s why so few are out there to choose from, it’s damn hard to play.
Let Buscher play, I bet he will be improved………and can hit.
WJ,
Everett is not as bad a hitter as his recent numbers indicate.
Batting 8th in the NL (ahead of the pitcher) means that NOBODY will throw you a decent pitch to hit.
He had decent stats before he was moved from 2nd to 8th in the batting order.
why not move mauer to 3rd, morneau to catcher, span to 1st, and slowey could play short.
the twins should show major interest in Kouzmanoff, forget this b.s. about trading Delmon for a prospect non power hitting SS, the kid hit 14 homers in AA whats to say he’s going to hit even 10 in the majors where pitching is better, and in the American league and in a pitchers park like the metrodome has been said to be now-a-days.
Kouzmanoff makes the most sense and the twins most likely wouldn’t have to give up too much
Span
Casilla
Mauer
Morneau
Kouzmanoff
Kubel
Young
tolbert/harris/punto
Gomez
nasty
great stuff casey, that’s actually more realistic than some of the ideas here…(not on this thread, yet).
Everyone:
I am NOT saying Morneau should be play third base in 2009 or any year. I’m just saying I bet he could. And Nathan could play SS.
WJ,
Lohse was better the minute he left the Twins:
2006 (Twins) 7.07 ERA 1.649 WHIP
2006 (Reds) 4.57 ERA 1.413 WHIP
2007 4.62 ERA 1.370 WHIP
2008 3.78 ERA 1.300 WHIP
So was Garza, so was Ponson. It took Romero one year and Balfour was out with surgeries for 2 seasons.
Maybe this team should admit that it has a hard time getting the best out of players who for some reason are in Gardy’s sizable doghouse and let it rest at that.
GENO…
YES I CAN!
Pohlad is cheap so instead of spending money on hiring a qualified GM he promoted Bill Smith…
Thus poor decision making is almost inevitable… so please understand.
Both parts are fully capable of being ripped.
Walter Johnson…
Nathan was a hell of a SS in high school.
i hope the twins hurry up and sign punto because i’m a click away from buying myself a punto jersey for xmas!
…yes, i’m serious. love punto!
Thank God BS doesn’t have to answer to this group. There is literally NO move he could make that would make people happy in here. None. Yet the only think that would make everyone even less happy would be for him to make no move at all.
balls
BS, Jim. There are plenty of moves he could make. It’s unlikely he could make us all happy, but I bet he could make some/most of us happy.
Lohse won a total of 12 games over 43 starts between leaving the Twins and winning 15 for St. Louis last season.
Thrylos…
Michael Cuddyer is the only person I know that has been in Gardy’s Doghouse and become one of his boys.
Remember when he was playing 3rd when Cuddyer was blamed for everything except 9/11?
Let me inform you guys of 2 infielders available, one a SS and one a 3B:
SS:
~ .275 10 HR 60 RBI’s .400 SLG in his first 2 full seasons as a major leaguer. .970 FP, .770 ZR, 4 RF; under club control for a couple more years
3B:
.290 4 HR 47 RBI in only 215 AB’s last year (projects to about 10 HR, 90 RBI in a full season), .940 FP, .774 ZR (so not that great with the glove but its only his second season) again he’s under club control for awhile; he does hit poorly agaist righties
Batted >.300 in multiple RISP categories
Who are they?
JimCrikket,
most of the moves that BS made last season (other than extending Rincon) were ok and helped the team. The 2 moves he made this season (extending Gardenhire -while still on contract for 2009, and releasing Ruiz) were not so ok…
Harris is not a shortstop and Buscher is awful not just “not that great” with the glove
Not surprisingly, I’d disagree with thrylos. But, I’m tired of discussing the past…
Yes Thrylos, but they are already here and dirt cheap - wouldnt cost anything in a trade and they are at the major league minimum. one shouldn’t expect the moon out of something like that.
It is said that the Rangers already paid Michael Young $20 mil. off of the $80 mil. So for 5 years of service and only $60 mil, I’d take that. If fills a big hole in our infield for a great amount of time. But what pitchers or players would they want in return??
BC–
Thanks for the numbers on Furcal (3/33, 4/40). However, I just read that he turned down 4/35 from the A’s.
If that is the going rate, I think the Twins should make an offer of 4/38 or something like that.
It’s entertaining coming back and seeing all the same names around here.
This was written back in the beginning of September by John Perrato and he seems to be knowing what he’s talking about seeing that some of these moves have already been made:
“The Marlins are considering playing Jorge Cantu at first next season, using Dallas McPherson at third, and trading Mike Jacobs in the offseason.” - Jacobs traded, so this looks pretty accurate.
“”The Rangers will try to trade Gerald Laird for pitching, given their surplus at catcher.” - Just happened yesterday
“The Padres seem willing to move Kevin Kouzmanoff once again. Perrotto doesn’t say, but it would make sense for young starting pitching to be the target for the Padres, and a move would allow Chase Headley to move back to his natural position, third base. The Giants are looking for help at third, but I doubt the Pads would trade him within the division. Minnesota, perhaps?” - Next???
I know this had been said to be unlikely but why not offer Crede 1 year at 4 million and if he plays in x number of games it will kick in a second year for 5 million if he does not make x number of games than it is option for 4 million for the 2nd year. Again this is not likely to happen but now the CC is gone and Sheets is talking to the Yankees offer the Brewers Perkins,Bonser and Mulvey and any other minor league pitcher if needed for Hardy. I know it’s not likely they will trade Hardy but they will need pitching. Sign Al Reyes and Keith Foulke to the BP amd pray Cuddy has a good year and can be traded at the deadline. Do not trade Young. Gardy needs to get over his favorites. No punto needed either. Alright now everyone can start ripping on me.
About a year ago, I was strongly in favor of signing Johan for a 5/100 deal. It would have been nice to go to the playoffs last year.
I would take all of these gripes more seriously, IF I didn’t remember 10 months or so ago when the CONSENSUS (may have been 1 or 2 who disagreed) on these blogs was that Denard Span was one of the WORST draft picks the Twins ever made.
Some of you might not have heard of Span, yet he did ok last year, particularly for a BUST. Won’t last, a classic overachiever.
Regards,
Jim…
Who would be unhappy if we pulled a trade to get JJ Hardy?
kouz had shoulder surgery not long ago that may have an impact on any possible trade until he is proven healthy.
Matt
I think you are on to something. If the Twins FO view Kevin K as a solid fielder.
BC,
I would trade anyone except Mauer and Morneau straight up for Hardy.
K Rod just sign 3/37 million with Mets.
Dragon…
Before his eye surgery, and miracle turn around last season I looked at Denard Span as a waste of a draft pick.
He did the one thing for a hitter that would make me change my mind… he started getting on base. lol.
I was strongly in favor of signing Johan for a 5/100 deal. It would have been nice to go to the playoffs last year.
Yeah, that turned out real well for the Mets.
jj hardy + joe mauer = lots of women at the dome
T:
Nice one.
Who would be unhappy if we pulled a trade to get JJ Hardy?
It all depends on who was given up. Look at Young/Garza as a prime example (though for many that was entirely hindsight)
Walter, I wonder if the Brewers would do a straight up Fransico Liriano for JJ Hardy deal. Liriano preformed well last year when he came back up, but I’m not sure how long his arm will last and he might look good to the Brewers, and as stated here before the Twins have alot of pitching.
David - that *gasp* would make Blackburn the #3 starter (I wouldn’t mind it, others would). I like it, but what if Liriano continues to improve and Hardy has a down year? We look like we have egg on our faces again.
Dragon, I think there was more than 1 or 2 of us. Coming out of spring training last year I wasn’t the only one believing that Span had earned the right to start at CF over Gomez and that Gomez could benefit from a little more time at AAA.
David:
Liriano can be a great one if he stays healthy. I think Hardy good enough to take that risk. Twins have better luck developing pitching.
T, we can’t quite judge that trade by 1 season, Garza 07 5-7 3.69 era Garza 08
11-9 3.70 era, Not mutch differance 07 16 games 08 30 games. lets see what Garza does for the next couple of years and what Young does if he is still a Twin. Tampa had alot of good young players have good years much like the 06 Twins.
Since I haven’t been focused on baseball for two months, I’m getting warmed up on the second guessing.
If the Twins spent $56million last year in payroll, and had the “flexibility” to spend $71million, what left fielder could they have signed for $10million in order to keep Garza, Bartlett, and Morlan?
Wait, I know the answer to that–and he wouldn’t have cost $10million, probably. Bonds was freely available all year. If we’d signed him (oo, media circus, I’m scared), to a one-year deal, we’d have no glut of outfielders. Better yet, we’d be able to keep playing him this year!
I’m still optimistic about DYoung, and don’t want to trade him. But signing a LF would have been preferable to trading good players for one.
Same as this year–let’s sign a good FA infielder, instead of trading away good players to get one. Thus my Furcal point.
I also have a solution to the ‘log jam’ in the outfield: start GoGo at AAA next year and have the OF be Span, Young, Cuddy with Kubel as the backup/DH. Then when Cuddy shows improvement and GoGo refines his bat at AAA, trade Cuddy for whomever is willing and call up GoGo
Kay–
Absolutely right–Span earned the CF job last year. Gomez needed time in AAA, and it also would have saved us a year on his clock.
I would be okay with a trade of JJ Hardy straight up for Liriano if we could lock up Hardy for 4-5 years. I just don’t see the Brewers being interested in anyone but our top 2 starting pitchers and I for one would rather see Liriano go than Baker. Still think we need to keep Delmon and see how he does in 2009 season.
SO WHAT?!? Cantu is a .270 29HR guy with some speed. He can spell Morneau every now and then while NP fills in at 3B. Eventually, he can DH…
The ball rockets off the concrete at the Dome and he has more time to get the ball to first than he would on grass. Or, run the DP to Casilla every play regardless if someone is actually on 1B or not…
Added some updates
I wouldn’t mind Liriano for JJ Hardy… it’s been said before, we need to give up something we have lots of (young pitching) for what we need, right handed bat at either SS or 3B… Hardy made just $2.65M last year to avoid arbitration, at 26 yrs old, I’d extend a 4 yr contract for $20-25M total, plus incentives… the guy should avg .280/.340/.470 and 23HRs over the next 2-3 yrs at least… I know we covet pitching here in MN Twin land, but somethings gotta give to get.
Medschoolmatt, If I’m not mistaken Blackburn pitched his best game of his career in the biggest game of his career on a cold night in Chicago in a playoff play in game. I would take my chances with him as my third starter.
Liriano is the great risk/reward guy on this entire roster (minor and major leagues). If healthy, he can be dominant. But, he’s been hurt 2 times already (that’s why they were able to get him “thrown in”). Keeping him is a risk, trading him is a risk. I’m betting they keep him, but a truly visionary/risk taking person would be willing to deal him for the right player(s).
The level of stupidity on this blog is unprecedented!! Blackburn as a third starter? the guy give up hits almost as fast as Livan, and I;m not sure he’s going to be better than Perkins.
Second trading Liriano for Hardy? You must be joking. A power pitcher who can overwhelm major league hitters is untouchable…even for a power hitting SS.
studboy … I guess you must not have been that impressed with Blackburn’s performance at Chicago in the one game playoff in the hostile atmosphere
If we’d signed Johan, not traded for DYoung, and signed Bonds (in addition to getting fitted for WS rings), we’d have a 2009 lineup of:
Span (CF)
Casilla (2B)
Mauer (C)
Morneau (1B)
Bonds (DH)
Cuddyer (RF)
Kubel (LF)
Buscher (3B)
Bartlett (SS)
Santana
Garza
Liriano
Baker
Slowey
David - heh, finally someone else who sees how good Blackburn is 
That’s pure geniousness.
Studboy, A power pitcher who has not been hurt for 2 of the 3 years that he has been in the league is untouchable…I love Liriano but I would move him for a young power hitting ss who is not in his prime yet.
David also Studboy - also, it wasnt his best game as he did have that one mistake (not his fault, they shouldnt have been pitching to him anyway); remember he lost another 1-0 game where he was even more dominant.
He was our most consistent pitcher last year save Baker and was a rock in our rotation - pitched the most innings out of anyone. And even with him slowing down in September, he gutted out that 2 run, 5 inning performance to keep us in it, then pitched his heart out against the Sux.
Studboy - comparing Blackburn to Hernandez is like comparing you with T - huge insult to T.
And a couple games before, Liriano totally falls apart vs. KC. Doesn’t look like he’s even interested in the game. If he puts away KC (like a no. 2 should) we don’t even have to play that last game against Chicago.
Blackburn could easily be our 3rd starter. Once he learns to throw something other than his cutter in big spots and trusts his curveball he should be better than last year. On top of that he shouldn’t wear down like it looked like he did down the stretch with the exception of game 163.
OK, back to reality. Liriano for Hardy, that’s just crazy talk. I also think we should hold on to DY.
Our GM track record, as everyone around here knows, is to sign declining, low OBP hackers/below average SP at cheap prices. Last year was Lamb, Monroe, and Livan. Before that, Ortiz, Batista, Rondell, etc.
The Twins need to step up and make a bigger signing, rather than a bunch of smaller ones.
Skips - yes, rookies aren’t entitled to get a bit tired after pitching all year, eh?
A rotation of Baker,Slowey,Perkins,Blackburn and 1 of the plethera of pitchers we have in the minors would not be to bad, if we were able to up grade our offense…also there are alot of FA starters out there that could hold down the # 5 spot or better not counting the top FA there ’s John Garland,Josh Fogg,Mark Mulder,Odalis Perez,Randy Wolfe,Jason Jennings,Brad Penny, Kenny Rogers, Kurt Schilling (yeh right) and maybe take a chance on Mark Prior for the 5 spot.
Don’t forget Randy Johnson - he’d put butts in the seats simply because its him.
I’d so love Jason Jennings or Josh Fogg, they’d be cheap, they are still young and have been reliable.
AM it not crazy talk if you want top players you have to trade a top player to get them unless it’s a salary dump. What do you think the Twins could get for Harris,Buscher, and Tolbert and Bonser? So one like Mike Lamb or Rondel White. Trade value to get value.
Walter,
We should have won every game last year if every player always did what they’re supposed to do all the time.
Should say some one.
Crazy talk is saying how we are going to dump 5 players we (fans) dont want on a team like the Mariners or Rangers for Beltre or M. Young… THAT’s crazy talk. Or thinking we’ll sign Furcal or Cabrera or Barry Bonds… what team is this again? I’m confused…
wait scratch what I just said on those two - they arent as good as I remember >_<
Randy Wolf looks like a better option.
It’s not unlike teams to trade top players to get top players in MLB it is just not like the Twins to do this, I hope this year is different.
Adam,
I disagree. Sometimes you do everything right and still lose. That’s baseball.
3:18pm: Troy Renck says the Rockies have not spoken to teams about Atkins. But it should be noted that Stark has only speculating with the Rockies portion of the below rumor.
10:53am: ESPN’s Jayson Stark is now speaking of “indications Monday night that Tampa Bay was still talking to the Twins about a deal that would bring outfielder Delmon Young back to the Rays.” Stark speculates that it could be a three-team deal where the Rays ship out Andy Sonnanstine or Edwin Jackson, maybe to Colorado as a means of getting Garrett Atkins to Minnesota. Stark had a source yesterday saying the Rays would “never” take Young back, but that has apparently changed.
Ah, speculation… love it.
I’ve got Pohlad at the top of my dead pool list, so maybe we’ll get lucky… unless he wants all his money buried in the vault with him…
Well I realise that Blackburn pitched very well for us last year and I’m not trying to take anything away from him, but he’s a just another groungball pitcher who give up too many hits and lives and dies with the DP.
If he had bombed against Chicago you’d all be ready to get rid of him. Look at his total body of work and realise his trade value is not likely to get any higher because all people remember about him right now is that he shut down the sux and should have won 16 games last year but our BP blew a hand full of games for him.
So you fickle idiots put that in your pipe and smoke it. He’s done nothing in the Majors or in his time coming through the Minors that suggests he will ever give up less than a hit an inning or strike out a significant number of batters. That being said about the only good things to say about nicky is that he’s a battler and throws strikes. If that makes him a #3 starter than OK. But I don’t want him facing Boston or Tampa’s #3 next year in the playoffs!
Walter,
I was referring to the players, not management. No big deal though.
Since we lost out on Blake, I don’t see us doing anything as far as upgrading 3B.
And I’ll be p*ssed if we trade Delmon and then he turns into the next David Ortiz… We better get the same type of player (one with crazy potential) if we trade him.. Trade Cuddyer if anything. He’s 7-8 years older than any of our outfielders..
It Figures,
Carl hasn’t run the team for a few years now. He has transferred control of all of his companies over to his 3 sons. IIRC, Jim is running the team now.
Carl dying will have NO effect on the Twins operation.
Lets say Blackburn Improves by 2 gamews next year to be 13-9, thats a good number 3 starter in the bigs.
Adam,
I was refering to the players too. Agree 100% on DY and Cuddyer.
Studboy,
Do you really see Tampa making the playoffs next season??? I know I don’t. I hope they do but I don’t see them winning the division again.
Sweet, you’re right. That is even worse because Jim will use the money to make more hhhomo movies like he did with Brokeback Mountain which he financed…
Looks like Bill Pohlad was in on the hhhomo movie too… What a waste of money…
It Figures,
How was that movie, anyway?
It Figures…
That is one of the most offensive things I’ve seen commented on here. I have friends who are gay and lesbian and really don’t appreciate your comment at all.
I don’t like the Pohlads much for how cheap they are with the Twins, but I think your homophobia needs to go back to the 18th century.
Of course Tampa makes the playoffs again. Bostons #3 starter right now is Jon Lester and if they sign Sabathia Dice-K will be their #3. Tampa’s #3 starter will probably be Price(who looked like pre-surgury Liriano).
If you guys still think Blackburn can cut it as our #3 starter you must not want to compete in the post-season or your as fickle and stupid as I’ve already stated!
I know it is a wish and never would happen but why don’t the Twins make a play for Peavy(I know he really wants to stay in the NL — but there are things we all want and can’t have) and Kouz? Or Shock the world more and make a play for Burnett? Allows you to package a pitcher(Blackburn, Perk, Boof) and Cuddy or DY for Beltre. Like a I said why not shoot for the moon CARL — you only have a few years left.
Studboy…
The D.Rays and the Red Sox will come out of the East.
50/50 the Twins come out of the Central
The Angels clinch the West by May 19th. lol
I’m not above insulting you guys but lets not bring hot button issues like sexual orientation into this sports blog…just my two sense
Walter. I tried to get financing through Bill’s production company and they were only making hhhomo, social movies… Now, if it was Brokeback Girls I would watch it… LOL
“Ah, speculation… love it.”
Every year it’s the same. All the possible deals the Twins could make to immprove the team and fill their glaring needs are discussed, hoped for, prayed for… and the Twins go and bring us ……… drumroll,……… pretty much nothing. Last year they did get a possible gem in DY, but the speculation mill is that they may screw this up.
Please Mr. Smith, give us a reason to get excited about this season.
BC keep pushing the ghey agenda pal and destroying families… you must be a buttpirate too…
BC,
Central will be stronger next year, don’t you think? Chicago still has pretty good pitching 1-3 (although I think Burhle will continue to decline). Detroit HAS to be better.
I love it… The Yankees and Mets want an extra 450 million for their stadiums, and Citibank has the naming rights to the Mets… fans want it changed to Tax Payer Stadium.
That’s almost Minnesota kind of evil against the sports teams. I love it.
I don’t think Jim has anything to do with the Pohlad Entertainment Ventures. That is all Bill
Look if we have to go with what we got and some second rate free-agents(again) in order to keep Young and our 1-3 starters than that’s just what it’s going to be, but a real setup man should be brought in. Not that I don’t have faith in Mijares but he’s just a rookie. Kerry Wood, Farnsworth, some righty who can throw 100MPH.
Walter…
I think all the teams in the Central will be better next year including the Twins. Detroit can actually be worse… They just signed Adam Everett… that’s a good 1st step in getting worse.
The Twins odds of winning the central are maybe 20%. Each team in the division is looking to get stronger as they all sense that everyone else is weak enough to pass. Heck even KC is looking at Furcal and other moves to improve.
Nice to see a couple of people on this blog are also interested in Furcal. I think he solves the Twins problems aside from pitching. And, with the Twins history of understanding the import of pitchers and their drafting stress on them, our bullpen will resolve itself with our inhouse options.
It Figures…
Unfortunately for you I am not, but from what I see 54% of all marriages end in 5 years, and homosexuals aren’t allowed to get married so it sure seems like we are screwing things up all by ourselves…
Let me guess, you don’t like african americans, asians, mexicans or jews either?
I wonder about Chicago, though. Kenny Williams is shopping Jermain Dye, Crede will be gone, they don’t have a center fielder, Thome is getting over-the-hill…
BC, don’t feed the troll.
Cleveland is the team the Twins need to watch out for next season.
BC,
I am not as pleased about the Yankees/Mets deal. They will get the money and it will trickle down to us upstaters….
But i guess i don’t pay the Hennepin county tax so i might as well help someone 
Nope BC, I’m jewish, married to an Asian. Divorce rate has nothing to do with it…
Kay…
alright
Kay, get back in the kitchen and make me a sammich
The Tribe is ready to sign Wood to a 2 year deal. Thats their one weakness..lets hope Wood gets hurt again.
Livian to the Reds
Reds sign our boy Livan.
http://blog.seattletimes.nwsource.com/mariners/2008/12/09/woods_to_indians.html
BC.B: “Who would be unhappy if we pulled a trade to get JJ Hardy?”
T responded exactly right… it would depend on who BS gave up to get Hardy. Everyone is all for getting Hardy if it means giving up “surplus” or damaged goods, but as soon as anyone dares mention that it would likely mean giving up Slowey or Baker PLUS others, then everyone backs off on their enthusiasm… yet in all likelihood that’s the kind of deal it would take.
Smith can’t win with this crowd unless he gets a quality FA on the cheal or makes a trade for a top tier player without giving up anyone of any value in return. Neither of those things is going to happen.
Walter…
I know that Chicago is shopping Dye, and makes some horrible trades, but they can still score a lot of runs.
I kind of expect the Twins to win about 8-10 more games next year than they did this year, and that’s because the starters should be stronger, and that will take off some of the pressure on the pen. Also Denard Span getting on base at the top of the lineup instead of Gomez should help the team get off to a stronger start.
The team I worry about is Cleveland for some reason. If they bring in a closer, and Haffner is actually healthy for a full season… Seizemore is a great ball player… that team could be a real pain in the division.
stud,
they are also weak at 3b, backend SP, possibly DH
“on the cheap”
fat fingers today… sorry.
According to Geoff Baker of the Seattle Times, the Reds signed Livan Hernandez.
Ha ha, i said Ha ha.
Shawn…
I would be very upset if I were a New Yorker… The stadiums are one thing, but the property across from it, and the specialty car ramp/car port that is private for the Yankees and their staff that is worth over 180 million all by itself.
JimCrikket -
I don’t care if the Twins had to trade Liriano for Hardy…
And even if they have to do something that includes Ben Revere I would be willing to trade him now… he’s 2-3 years from being a MLB player on any level, and the odds of him then becoming a star… heck yeah I would trade any prospect we have (except we cannot trade our picks from last year) to get Hardy…
As long as it’s not Mauer or Morneau… I’m more than willing to listen.
I predict Livan will put up a 6.50 ERA for the Reds. And win 12 games.
WJ will he throw the Eephus pitch???
Cleveland has offered Kerry Wood a two-year deal: http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=3758037.
Cleveland and KC seem to be the two teams trying to improve in the Central. Detroit and the Sox seem more in a maintenance/rebuilding mode. The Twins … remains to be seen.
jimmy bee, Almost exclusively. Plus he will add an underhanded delivery.
BC.B… and being willing to “listen” is great and very open minded of you. I’m sure Smith is willing to listen, too. But the Brewers are under no pressure to move Hardy so they’d demand the moon and stars.
There’s only one sure thing around here that I’d be willing to bet my house on… and that’s that Bill Smith will get trashed in this, and virtually every other, blog no matter what he does or doesn’t do.
LAVELLE:
Why are the twins interested in Atkins. He is a product of Coors field, last year he hit more than 100 points better at home than on the road (342 at home versus 233 on the road). If he joins the twins, it would lucky if he hit over 250. I just don’t get why the twins would give up someone like Young for a right handed Buscher? Atkins sucks, he had one good season two years ago, but just look at his home/road split, terrible.
http://mlb.mlb.com/stats/individual_player_splits.jsp?c_id=mlb&playerID=425548&statType=1
Uh, BA has released its rankings and Hicks is number 1. That was three weeks ago, and Joe posted it in his blog.
Kay - if he brings in a legit player to help out areas in need without giving up a lot in everyday players/prospects, how can he be bashed?
Atkins was 4th in RoY balloting in 2005. In 2006 he was in consideration for MVP.
Would it make sense to sign Mark Grudzielanek to play 2nd and move Casilla to SS? We would still need or wouldn’t have power at 3rd but maybe a Grudz signing would be cheap enough to let us make a good deal for a guy at 3rd? Grudz is a career .290 hitter and bit .299 last year.
Looks like the nickname gremlins are back.. FWIW, the 4:18 comment attributed to “Kay” was mine.
Kay, so far I haven’t seen Cleveland or KC really improve themselves. I’m not at all disappointed that the Tribe are going to add Wood as their closer… I was afraid they might get someone… you know… good.
I’m also not the least disappointed with reports that Sabathia has nixed the Yankees’ offer and is most likely going to the Brewers or Giants. Stay over in the NL, Capt Cheeseburger!
Perkins and Delmon to the Brewers for JJ Hardy
what’s the opinion?
6.5 ERA, I dont care if you win 25 games, that’s horrible… good luck Reds, probably blocking more promising arms coming up in your minors…
Get it done BC
WJ underhanded delivery. Wow maybe he will learn how to throw a side arm knucle curve
MarkW, you are saying you wouldn’t take the 25 games?
Sidearm knuckle curve? sounds like an alcoholic drink 
Yes, ERA is much more important than wins. Not.
I wouldn’t complain about that deal, BC.B, but I don’t see any way the Brewers would do it UNLESS they find a way to retain Sabathia. Otherwise, they have to replace Sabathia and Sheets and they aren’t going to do it with Perkins.
It gets so annoying having to retype all my info every 3rd comment.
Not enough for the brewers unless they move an OF they don’t need Delmon. And even if they do they probably wouldn’t do it.
BC.
No way. Delmon’s still got stud potetial. Same with Perkins. I say go get Furcal. He was not offered arbitration so will not cost anything but $ and years. He came back real strong from back surgery.
Here’s my theory why pitchers like Santana get no run support and guys like Livan can manage to win 10 games giving up 3-4 hits an inning: Livan keeps his fielders active during the game so they hit better when it’s their time up. Guys playing behind Johan are bore half to death watching him whiff batters with his change. They are half-asleep when the come off the field.
med, Kay didn’t say anything at 4:18. Someone hijacked my name.
ah ok; Walter took credit for it.
I said everything I said. At least today anyway.
BC — I would look at Cuddy and Perkins for Hardy but I still like the upside of DY. Plus getting rid of Cuddy’s contract is a plus. The key question is who else do you think we could get for DY and Perkins if that is what we are giving up? Would Seattle look at Beltre? Colorado Aitkins? How about Texas and M. Young or Baltimore a B.Roberts(move Casilla to SS) Unfortunately I don’t see BS looking at all options so it is probably a moot point
Jim,
If they can’t resign Sabbathia which they most likely won’t because he’s not a man of any character at all… (a manny ramierez kind of jerk) that the Brewers would resign Ben Sheets, and that they would look at a couple of others…
I also think the Twins would probably have to add in another pitching prospect into a deal, but would probably want a young player in A-AA in return as well.
To say they won’t look at all options is stupid. They will look at everything that could help the team. Whether they act on it or not is another matter.
BC- I don’t get the “jerk” vibe from CC at all. If he signs with the Yankees for a huge amount, I will grant that he may indeed be a man of low moral character. But if he accepts an offer from the Brewers or Giants- can’t really fault him.
But yeah, he should stay in the National League.
Hardy is one of the Brewers best young players. Not a prospect. I don’t think you can get Melvin to give him up for quantity. It would take a similar-stature player.
If rumors are to be believed I will be even more disappointed in the Twins if the Brewers can pull off keeping CC. Explain to me how Milwaukee can do that and the Twins couldn’t keep Johan? An why now we can’t make a play for Peavy or Burnett
Sorry I falsely accused you of hijacking JimCrik - I read your post after. My bad.
Patiently awaiting news from LENIII that the Twins have ACTED to improve the team….
BFE… I think that’s way too much to give up for Beltre. Beltre is a 1 year rental who is one year older coming off of a season ending injury at 12.5 million or something like that.
For Beltre I would not give up one of our starting pitchers. I just wouldn’t.
I would do Perkins and Young for Atkins if and only if Atkins signed a 3-4 year deal to avoid free agency in two years.
Skips — with the track record of the Twins lately how can you possibly think they actually look outside the box at all and canvas all options? History seems to show they don’t
I meant Jim, my bad
LEN - hopefully BS is actually doing something as we speak.
Swannie- CC once said he didn’t care if cleveland lost 100 games as long as they beat the Twins… it was on Jim Rome’s show on ESPN about 3 years ago… 300 lbs and a lefty with an attitude problem… I smell a Kevin Brown/Mike Hampton kind of failure brewing with CC if he signs with NY. Which wouldn’t bother me a bit.
BC..What if you could get Beltre to sign for another 2-3 years? If it is Cuddy in the deal instead of DY it helps out on the money aspect. Considering it is Perkins or Blackburn aren’t one of the Twins top 3 it might make sense.
6.5 ERA is never good, no matter what you couple it with to sugar coat it… and ERA isn’t a great example of a pitchers effectiveness from the mound anyways… if a pitcher is “credited” with 25 wins with that high of an ERA, I would say his offense played the largest role in those “wins”, since they would have to avg that or above for runs scored each time he took the mound… he’s not getting batters out to be deemed a good or even mediocre pitcher… so no, I would take the offense that could keep up the runs scored avg over the pitcher’s so-called “wins”…
Just because they don’t act on it doesn’t mean they don’t look at it. And as far as signing Johan he didn’t want to pitch here and thats what it comes down to.
BC, Twins are going to win 8-10 more games next year? They better get into the CC sweepstakes. I love the Twins, but this ain’t a 98 win lineup.
BC…personally that quote from CC is one of the reasons I like the guy. He added to what little rivalry the Twins actually have out there now. Sorry but I grew up hating the A’s, Royals and Yankees being a Twins fan. The Indians and Tigers were in the East and The Sox sucked. I would love to see CC as a Twin. A pitcher with an attitude is always good. Especially when he can back it up. Would worry about the weight factor though if I was giving up the 100M.
BFE -
We don’t want Burnett because of his attitude, and his injury history. He’s not known to be a team ball player, and Gardy won’t stand for that as seen with Garza…
And we won’t go after Peavy because Peavy won’t accept a trade here. He wants to stay in the NL, and play for a contender.
As sad as it is to say… baseball players don’t look at MN as a destination…
If I were the Twins going after free agent pitchers… I would go after Derek Lowe (consistant innings eater), and I would take a flyer on John Smoltz because if Smoltzy is healthy for the 2nd half of the year… there is your bullpen help big time.
I just keep pounding through the Rule 5 players trying to see if there is anyone the Twins will take a chance on and I think they may take Mourlon back from the D.Rays.
Walter Johnson says:
December 9th, 2008 at 4:24 pm
MarkW, you are saying you wouldn’t take the 25 games?
In Reply:
6.5 ERA is never good, no matter what you couple it with to sugar coat it… and ERA isn’t a great example of a pitchers effectiveness from the mound anyways… if a pitcher is “credited” with 25 wins with that high of an ERA, I would say his offense played the largest role in those “wins”, since they would have to avg that or above for runs scored each time he took the mound… he’s not getting batters out to be deemed a good or even mediocre pitcher… so no, I would take the offense that could keep up the runs scored avg over the pitcher’s so-called “wins”…
didn’t mean to post that twin, blog was going haywire on me…
and by twin, I mean “twice”
okay, i’m done
BFE
If we can trade Cuddyer I am listening to every opportunity period.
But if it’s a deal with Seattle I want one of those young relievers back with the deal provided Beltre is here for 3 years.
To me that is the key number any 3rd baseman the Twins get has to be able to be here for 3 years to justify a starting pitcher… That would make Delois Guerra a top line prospect if he’s the real deal, and with Swarzack/Duensing/Humber/Manship and Shooter Hunt all available to fill that 5th spot until Guerra is hear to prove me wrong on Bill Smith I think we need 3 years out of a 3rd baseman. Especially with our track record of stalling out prospects by AA at 3rd
BC — getting Mourlon back would at least make the trade less damaging. As far as Burnett being a headcase that could be don’t really know anything on that. I do know the part about Peavy wanting to stay in the NL but there was talk of Boston and NYY being in the mix for alittle while. Never know unless you ask. $$$ changes people’s minds no and again.
BC — getting Mourlon back would at least make the trade less damaging. As far as Burnett being a headcase that could be I don’t really know anything on that. I do know the part about Peavy wanting to stay in the NL but there was talk of Boston and NYY being in the mix for alittle while. Never know unless you ask. $$$ changes people’s minds no and again.
BC — well we are on the same path with Cuddy. An yes any 3B acquistion should be at least a 3 year deal. Which young relievers are you talking about?
Well, as usual the Twins are sitting on
their hands, doing nothing to upgrade
their team. Sure, they don’t need too
much in order to take that next step,
and become World Series contenders, but
there are a couple positions they need
to address.
Offensively, they once again need an
everyday third baseman, with 20 homerun
power, and a decent glove. Finding an
everyday third baseman has been a
problem, ever since Corey Koskie left,
but this off-season the Twins were
presented with the perfect solution for
third base! Casey Blake. Blake, who
was a free agent, is a very durable,
and decent hitter, with 20 homerun power,
and is also good with the glove. He
wasn’t asking for huge money either, but
as usual, he signed with another team
instead, because the Twins didn’t want
to give him a three-year contract. This
is so typical of the Twins. What’s the
difference between a two-year, or
three-year contract? The difference is,
the Twins are being cheap, and just
don’t want to spend the extra money.
As far as the Twins pitching is concerned,
they need a relief pitcher/set up man,
who can replace Pat Neshek. Their
starting pitching is great, so other than
a relief pitcher, the Twins pitching is set.
But, the Twins have made no indications of
signing a free agent relief pitcher, and
with Blake as a third baseman off the table,
basically the only thing left for the Twins
to do, is to address their needs through a
trade. The latest rumor has the Twins
trading Delmon Young, and or a minor league
pitcher, in exchange for Miguel Tehjada from
the Astros, or some third baseman prospect
from the Phillies. For one thing, there is
no way the cheapskate Twins are going to take
on a big name players contract! The Twins
never sign big name players, who are still
good. For another thing, the Twins never
seem to be willing to trade pitching
prospects, even when they have plenty.
It would be great if the Twins would make
a big trade, to upgrade the team, but I
would be very surprised! Blake was the
perfect opportunity for the Twins to fix
the third base problem, without having to
trade anybody, and in my opinion, become
World Series contenders. Once again, they
let an opportunity get away. Typical Twins!
BFE
The Yankees and the Red Sox have so much clout that they can barge their way into any conversation. Minnesota has such a cheap reputation among the agents, and players that we aren’t even on the radar for a lot of players.
It’s not as bad as it is for the Timberwolves, but then again the Twins management isn’t anywhere near that bad… heck as much as I don’t like George Bush Jr and his cronies… they might not be as bad as the Timberwolves management.
[…] Twins Insider – […]
If we can move Morneau to third, let’s move Mauer to short. He’s a great athlete with a strong arm to make the long throws and, being a former quarterback, probably has great footwork in to turn the double play. We can then have Redmond be our catcher. Put Delmon Young at first. cause Cuddyer is a better outfielder. Spam in left, Gonzalez center, Cuddyer in right. Casilla at second with Tolbert and Harris as utility fielders.
No trade is needed.
ok Rustycat that is possibly the dumbest and most unrealistic idea I have ever heard, please leave this chat.
