Mailbag: Driving(!) on the greenway
Posted on July 17th, 2009 – 10:02 AMBy Roadguy
Got this e-mail last night from alert reader Becky:
This evening, while riding my bike on the Greenway, I witnessed something so strange, I completely forgot I had my crapcam on me, and regret not taking a photo…
As I was biking east towards Nicollet, I passed an elderly woman DRIVING HER CAR on the Greenway! She had entered the onramp from Nicollet, as I saw her round the tight corner, and squeeze under the cement bridge supports when I biked past (very cautiously).
By the time I reached Nicollet, she had gone too far for me to snap a picture. 
But oh, what a sight! I thought about calling the police, but honestly wasn’t sure if they would find her by the time she found a proper road. I hope another biker was able to direct her off the pathway…
Roadguy has witnessed maintenance and police vehicles on the Midtown Greenway, but never a lost motorist. The entrance at Nicollet does indeed look a bit like a freeway ramp or a driveway, but good grief. Sounds like it needs more than a “no trucks” sign.
23 Responses to "Mailbag: Driving(!) on the greenway"
I think the sign says “no motor vehicles”! I checked when I was in awe of the situation, before biking home. But it’s a tiny little sign… barely noticeable.
Usually at trailheads there’s some posts or other such gate to prevent this from happening. You really should have turned around and at least got her license plate, if not have called the cops then and there and followed ’til they showed up. Someone that can’t make the distinction between roadway and trail should not be driving any more…
Speaking of trailheads, I’m curious if anyone knows the answer to this: Off of Cuyuga St., just west of 35E is St. Paul there is a trailhead for the Gateway St. Trail. There is no parking there, but half a block or so west is a fairly large parking lot that appears to have no purpose. There are no businesses or anything like that around. It would be great for trail parking, but alas it is well-marked as to not park there. It is a big empty parking lot that I’ve never seen used. Odd.
When I was about 10 years old, a group of teenagers were driving down a suburban bike trail in the deep woods very quickly. I happened to be on the dirt trail next to the main trail at the time so I didn’t get hit.
The car couldn’t fit around a corner and crashed. It was awesome (from the perspective of a group of 10 year olds).
We didn’t call the cops because there were no cell phones then (early 80s) and we were so far from home or anywhere with a phone that we just booked it out of there as quickly as possible. We went back the next day and there was no evidence of a car crash.
Time to take away the keys, perhaps? Becky, more important than a photo to post on a blog, I hope you got the license # and reported the incident to the police.
This just on the heels of the story of the 87 year old who caused the I94 shutdown last weekend…
Yah, I have heard of that, and seen it myself. Some bike roads have some big center posts so a car can’t fit through. But you want to be able to get an ambulance or a police cruiser in.
And it isn’t just the old folks that do this, like Kilt was mentioning.
Maybe she drives down West River Road quite often, where bikers insist on riding in the road instead of on the trail that runs right next to the road and just figured that roads and dedicated bike trails are interchangeable.
Same joke works with Washington Avenue, which has two sets of dedicated bike lanes running parallel just a block away.
On the Professor’s note, we have a similar issue here.
Per the National Park Service, bikes are prohibited on the George Washington Parkway. However, today alone, I saw 6 people biking along it.
On one of the local bike blogs, it’s discussed that the more serious bicyclists use the GW Pkwy because it’s higher speed with fewer potential issues than a nearby minor arterial (which has a lower speed limit and, unlike the Pkwy, traffic signals). And they don’t use the parallel trail because it has tighter turns and slower traffic (both bikes and peds).
So that’s a plausible reason why there’s bikers on the road part of West River Rd. The difference being that, in the Minneapolis case, they’re legally allowed to.
Prof S knows perfectly well that the bike paths have a 10 mph speed limit and that most of the cyclists using the adjacent parkways are riding over 20 mph. (And that those who are not going that fast still have the right to be there.)
Seriously, stop beating your oft-rebutted dead horse already, Prof.
Give the bikes a break (brake?), Prof, ’cause there are more people and more vehicles of all kinds every day…
Bike roads are fine, and I use them all the time. A few are in rough shape–some are gone completely or closed off.
There’s a school of thought, I believe, that suggests that bike paths along roads can be worse, because they intersect with traffic very frequently–especially turning vehicles–instead of flowing along traffic. Drivers don’t always know what to do (some know and push through regardless). Get a load of Minnehaha Parkway/50th St, Mpls…
Total six different directions car traffic, four directions bike traffic, and ONE stop sign…
Bike paths that are more isolated are a blast–and can be used like a freeway to get to where you’re going.
Those center posts are usually on hinges so they can be laid flat to let emergency vehicles through.
About a year ago my boyfriend was biking home from work on the greenway and was almost hit by a car. They were trying to evade the police and thought they could escape via the greenway.
I should have gotten her plates! I didn’t even think of that… again, I was so shocked by the whole thing, by the time I turned around, she was already a good distance away. Next time… 
There were many others in that area, too, so I’m assuming someone closer to her stopped her or handled the situation… I hope!
Morg,
I see the lot you are talking about for the Gateway, but I probably wouldn’t use it.
1 - Not sure I’d want to leave my vehicle in the area. Generally a little sketchy and not very much foot or other traffic = break in.
If you’re driving to the trailhead anyway, I’d start a little further out. The first portion of the trail (Cayuga to Maplewood) is ok, but overall much nicer out past 694. Park in the lot on 55th street, right at the 36 and 694 junction, and ride west.
2. No official parking listed on website for trail. City street parking only. If I had to park around there, I’d go more towards Rice street and just ride over to the trail head. http://www.dnr.state.mn.us/state_trails/gateway/directions.html
Mary also knows that very, very few people actually ride at only 10 mph on the trail. That is the biggest red herring argument you regularly see in this debate.
Barry - just because the trails are in bad shape doesn’t mean that they should take up the cars’ space. Cars couldn’t do the same thing - i.e. drive in the bike lane becuase the main roadway has too many bumps.
There are a lot of things you can do, but that does not mean you (a) should do it, (b) are not posing a danger to yourself and others by doing it, or (c) are a real self-centered jerk by doing it.
“self-centered jerk”
Hmm, that’s an interesting term.
It’s all relative.
Max speed of the parkways 25mph. Many of the bikers go around 15-25 most of the time. Legally, they can. Is it a pain in the rear for you, Prof? You bet it is. When I take the bike path and tots, dogs, joggers and skaters temporarily “impede” my progress, I wait patiently, smile, go around when I get an opportunity, and wave–because I know most of them are not “self-centered jerks.”
Barry - you illustrate my point perfectly. The biker on the road doesn’t want to ride on the trail because he doesn’t want to be impeded. So his solution is to impede others.
It’s this great hypocrisy. I can’t be impeded, but when cars make the exact same complaint, I’ll be offended and tell them to just suck it up.
My place is surrounded by dedicated bike lanes. I’m all for them and get frustrated when I see drivers convert them into turn lanes (threatening the bikers in the process). But I’m also annoyed when the bikes abandon those lanes and take up the roadway instead - whether in some effort to make a statement or just becuase they think they can.
Well put, Prof.
Not quite what I meant Prof… I do use the bike roads, and I am impeded–but I don’t let it get to me. I patiently wait a few seconds for the dog, jogger, toddler, skater, to move to the right and I’m on my way. The only time I don’t use a bike road is when it goes a different way than I am or if it’s closed.
If another biker chooses the parkway, it is legal–like it or not. It’s not my place to educate or monitor others that aren’t hurting anyone. But, if I see anyone threatening any bicyclist as you have seen, I call plate numbers in to 9-1-1.
Actually, Prof., cars ARE supposed to pull into bike lanes when turning. After checking for bikers, of course.
That’s right David. It’s that “after checking for bikers” part that often doesn’t take place. Motor vehicles are required to yield to bikes in bike lanes before entering and/or crossing them.
The best place to be in relation to a right turning vehicle (whether you’re on a bike or in a car) is either to left of it, behind it, or in front of it. It’s always a bad idea to be to the right of a right turning vehicle.
David - come along 11th Avenue and watch cars basically drive through the bike lane for a block or so like it’s a second lane and you’ll know what I’m talking about. This isn’t the “I’m pulling to the right to take a right,” it’s the “I’m going to drive through this bike lane because I’m going to turn up there,” or “the car ahead of me is going to take a left, so I’ll just drive in this bike lane for awhile.” Yeah, at some point you cross the bike lane, but it’s right before you turn.
i bike in elm creek park preserve and saw a sign on a fairly long wood bridge for the bike/walker path that said max weight 10k lbs. i thought that was odd till i came around a corner and nearly hit a park truck doing maintenance. i keep my eyes open now.
wiz2jay: I would never think of parking in that area, I have just done some work in the area, and I don’t think that lot is intended as trail parking. I was just curious if anyone knew exactly WHAT the lot was for, as it is well-posted as to NOT park there. The lot, and its location, just seem odd and out of place. Why CAN’T anyone park there?
