Kahn deals again: QRich to Miami for…Mark Blount!?
Posted on August 13th, 2009 – 10:01 PMBy Jerry Zgoda
First, Etan Thomas.
Now, Quentin Richardson.
Soon, Mark Blount.
For the second time this summer, David Kahn dealt away a player before he ever really arrived in Minnesota. This time, the Wolves dealt Richardson — acquired from the L.A. Clippers last month in that 3-for-1 deal that sent Craig Smith, Sebastian Telfair and Mark Madsen westward — late Thursday night to Miami and brought back veteran center Mark Blount (of all people).
This deal, too, is all about cost saving and salary-cap stuff.
Both players have expiring salaries, but the Wolves will save nearly $1.4 million by waiving Blount and his $7.96 million contract rather than dump Richardson’s $9.35 million contract.
By making this deal, it’s clear Kahn never intended having Richardson, who likely would have been a runaway gunner in his contract year, on this season’s team.
Kahn still could deal Blount’s contract in another deal, but it seems like waiving him outright is more likely.
Either way, he’ll be back with the Wolves on paper only — and probably fairly briefly — nearly two years after the Wolves’ old regime miraculously traded Ricky Davis and Blount to the Heat for Antoine Walker and that 2009 first-round pick that Kahn in essence dealt to Denver for a future first-round pick.
ONE MORE THING: Kahn will go to Poland next month for part of the European championship in which Ricky Rubio’s playing for Spain. Kurt Rambis might go for some of it, too.
262 Responses to "Kahn deals again: QRich to Miami for…Mark Blount!?"
The name Mark Blount at once gives me neck spasms, a headache, and the Hershey squirts.
No, it’s not swine flu. It’s Mark Blount!
Feeling queezy. Say it ain’t so.
KEEP HIM! It’ll rule to have him as a back-up center!
Kahn needs a nickname like Trader Jack had.
Any ideas people?
Shockah Khan…?
My head’s spinning… This is getting more and more confusing…
Too bad we couldn’t at least get a 2nd too.
Khan has some mad scientist scheme going on…only explanation for Blount. That and clearing cap room to get a big name next summer…plus our glut of first round picks…
Khan’s doing a nice job laying a future groundwork as far as I can see…money to spend and (probably) high picks in what is expected to be a deep draft.
I have no idea how Kahn convinces these other teams to these deals. I mean, who actually wants QRich?
Matt sounds good, Shockah Kahn it shall be!
Just buy out Blount? Seems a little odd that we just dumped Telfair and Smith in return for nothing but savings.
Now that i read it will save the Wolves money it makes a little sense, but it would have been nice to use Q’s contract to aquire somebody who could play. Blount is one of the most pathetic centers out there, a legit 7′ center who cant rebound or play defense. At least Q could have provided some production at his position. Not a big fan of the move.
Your right Tod, the loss of smith makes no sense now. He would have been nice off the bench this year. Blount? What a stiff!
RealGM Player Rankings has Blount at 383 out of 451 for last season.
Of course, his salary comes in as 88th highest in the league.
Oh great, Blount mention gave me a breakout of fungus of the mungus. Please, Kahn, make it stop!
I don’t know how many minutes Smith would’ve gotten behind Al and Love…throw in Songaila, etc., and we’re pretty deep at power forward…and there’s no way they could keep putting Smith in there at center (they did that a few times last year)…WAY too undersized to handle a good 2/3 of the league’s centers.
I don’t think Blount will ever set foot in MN, and I see a buyout happening real fast…but I see Hollins as a guy that they’ll put out there and see what he can do. Best way to develop someone is to get him minutes.
That’s a hefty buyout. I don’t think Taylor would want to just throw away that kind of money, getting zilch in return, unless it’s solely to create a roster spot. There must be something more to this. My Spidey sense is tingling.
Very confusing trade. I guess this is some of the trimming Kahn was talking about.
So, is it better to just buy him out now or keep around as a potential trade piece?
Does Blount ever set foot on an NBA court again?
I wonder if Kahn has any real players out there that he wants to trade for at this point, or if he thinks he isn’t acquiring any real help at this point. So everything is just about salary now.
Ok a few things that need to be clarified here.
1.) This saves us no money NEXT year. So it doesnt clear anymore cap space for 2010. Both contracts turn to 0 next year
2.) It saves us money and cap THIS year. As Jerry said about 1.4 million worth.
This was a smart move if the team was planning on buying out a contract to open a roster spot. We create more room this year to potentially sign carney to a 1 year contract. and were smart by not just cutting q.
ultimately you guys were expecting way to much for q. i could see it coming a mile away..Kahn thinks we will be big players in free agency next year..im not so sure about that yet but we will definitly have the cap space to be.
I may be too much of an optimist here, but we don’t have to be “that big” of a player next summer. Think about it…assuming Flynn pans out, we’ve got a good young point (plus Rubio whenever he crosses the pond). Small forward is Gomes, and he’s been solid there since he got to MN. Al and Love at 4 and 5. So our only true “hole” is at the 2 guard spot. We’ll have Wayne E. hopefully developing at SG, but I really only see SG as a “must fill” next summer.
It’d be nice to have a 7 foot center who can really play (maybe Hollins develops into that, but I’m not holding my breath), but it isn’t quite as much of a necessity…the league is getting shorter at center.
If we straight-up buy out Blount, then Kahn gave away Telfair and Craig Smith, two decent players, for nothing but savings THIS YEAR. Can’t even use future cap space as a cover-up for straight salary-dumping on this one.
Depending on what’s done with Blount, I see Kahn and this Timberwolves “rebuilding process” in a whole new light. It’s not about future flexibility. It’s about cutting costs and lying to the fans while doing it.
If Big Al follows through like he says he is going to we should be looking for a center in the draft. To play center, he had bulked up to 285 or bigger last season. This summer he resolved to get back to his rookie weight of 265. I Would be happy if he could follow through on this quote too, Jefferson, for his part, says he’ll be like Amare Stoudemire.
Maybe now that Hollins will actually get real min he might turn out to be decent.
Sam: yes it is about cutting costs this year which sucks but it is also about unloading two guys that probably won’t sit quietly on the bench and watch our rookies develop. Bassy wouldn’t have seen a minute on this team and I doubt Smith would have seen much more. Now they won’t disrupt our locker room and they will have an opportunity for PT in LA.
Jerry, how soon before Blount is dumped?
matt you are overvaluing and homerising ellington and gomes who in most cases are spot starting role players or bench players. Ellington could prove me wrong but he doesn’t look like nba starting sg material. and no one expected that from him i dont believe.
You can NEVER have to many assets. Acquiring a good to great player in free agency could make another valuable piece on our team more expendable and we could then trade that piece for a good piece that is more of need
im glad kahn is smarter than you guys..Some of you sound like mchale right now wanting to get a veteran to band aid our team again for the short term.
Oh and everyone look for us to sign carney next to a 1 yr deal. This trade saves us 1.4 mil for us to sign him. He would look great with rubio,flynn, brewer and hollins running the floor!
Btrue311:
I probably didn’t say this clearly enough: I don’t think Wayne E is going to be a starter, at least not for several years (if at all).
Gotta disagree with you on Gomes though…Gomes has been solid since he got here and has quietly put up some solid numbers. Not flashy, big a very solid, steady player.
Blount = buzz kill
Matt
I guess i totally agree with you on those players value then, i just don’t agree that we don’t need an upgrade at those positions. Gomes is very solid but we could definitely do better by acquiring a player like joe johnson which could happen with the cap space we will have(long shot i know but still a chance)
Btrue= Bryan the Burger King janitor
I love Gomes. I love Brewer. I love Ellington…
But at the end of the day, I guess I’d like to see us add a more dynamic player on the wings.
That’s why I’m OK with possibly overpaying to get a guy like Joe Johnson up to Minnesota.
Again, what I said was that I think we need to pursue a starting SG next summer. Center would be nice, but isn’t as big a priority to me as the shooter is.
The league has gotten a LOT smaller at center in the last decade, which is why guys like Al and K-Love can really hold their own at that spot in the lineup being a little undersized.
If I were Shockah, I’d say go after Cole Aldrich in the draft (assuming he keeps his numbers up) and pick up a Joe Johnson type in free agency.
Look, teams sell 1st-round draft picks for a $3 Million fee every year.
The Wolves traded Rhino and Telfair for $2.7M in cap space next year and $1.4M in real cash for 2009.
I don’t care how much cash Glen Taylor has… this venture (The Wolves) is hemoraging money. To move a bunch of role players for cash and (more importantly) cap space for 2010.
If Kahn pulls off signing a great FA next summer, it will be in large part because he got rid of Telfair… seriously. The way Kahn works, I’m curious to see if he’ll be able to dump Songalia’s player option too.
We still need size. Hollins may get pushed around, Al’s defense is suspect,I don’t think the master is done yet.
Maybe Kahn will just keep swapping players to whittle away salary.
*Madsen, Rhino, Telfair - total owed $10.54M.
*Q-Rich - total owed $9.3M.
*Blount - total owed $7.96M
$10.54 to $9.3M to $7.96M…
He’s working the red paper clip trading spree in reverse!
Kahn is the anti-mchale, first he drafts arguebly the best player (regardless of position)and actually keeps him instead of trading him away to be a star somewhere else.
Now he is getting rid of the “decent” role players (nchale loved) who were only good enough to keep us in the middle of the lottery by stealing a win now and then. Wolves are going to be bad, but should still be entertaining with some good young talent plus we have hope for the future with cap space and extra draft picks.
what?
ieddad pooh - Right on. Kahn isn’t the least bit interested in having a team that is consistently a 40-45 win team that it battling just to get into the playoffs, where they’ll get swept.
This theme was clear in this LONG Wolves story that leads ESPN.com’s basketball page right now.
http://myespn.go.com/blogs/truehoop/0-43-41/Ripping-the-Timberwolves-Down-to-the-Studs.html
This year is definitely going to be a growing-pains type of year…but that’s what I like about it. We’re finally ACTUALLY rebuilding. None of McHale’s “go halfway and try to rebuild on the fly” garbage — just straight rebuilding. Keeping Al and K-Love, getting a top rookie PG in Flynn and hopefully Rubio, and letting this season become a classroom for the guards.
Like Kahn said, if there’s any team in this league with time to rebuild and experiment, well, it’s us.
In that TrueHoop story from ESPN that I just posted, Kahn refers to the next two seasons as a “labratory.”
I’m not sure if this guy is able to stradle the fence. He’s rebuilding and he’s rebuilding ALL THE WAY.
Hey — let’s not kid ourselves here!! What big-time free agent are we going to be able to get next year anyway? No big-time player in his right mind is going to come up here to MN to play in this cold barren wasteland no matter how much money he’s offered. All the stars want to play in warm-weather cities like Miami, LA, the Texas teams, etc. We’re just fooling ourselves here.
All about flexibility - neither blount nor qrich were going to play anyways. Maybe now can join with another contract to get a player we might keep? Or just save money. Both options good.
Darth - Generally, I agree with you, BUT…
Very few teams have enough cap room to sign a big-contract player from the 2010 FA Class. The Wolves are slated to have the 4th-most cap space next off-season.
Money Talks.
The Wolves are one of only a few teams that will have ample cap space and be willing to spend it.
Kahn’s got an eye on the economy, too. When a LOT of other teams are still gonna be in fire sale mode (one year is NOT going to change the economic landscape of the game so much that green doesn’t talk), we’ll be one of the few teams with money to throw around.
And then there’s the contingency plan: the draft. If we wind up keeping all three picks (I’d say there’s a good chance of that), then we’re picking three first rounders in a deep draft. We can get a center, shooting guard, and whatever other holes we’ll need/want to fill.
I doubt we will get Charlotte’s pick next year. They stink, unless Larry Brown does some magic (which is possible).
Foo, Who are the other teams?
OK lets see here we freeing cap space up for a player (Q-Rich) that wasnt a big fan of minnesota and said to the organization that he wasnt going to be here and demanded a trade dont believe me?? read sources on him and it plainly says that he didnt want to play in MN and it says he didnt even buy a place to live here.
Now we need a SG i think we all know that and we freed up some cap space and we have no depth at SG i suspect that we use some of that money and sign a SG from FA for a year and dump him at the end maybe 2 years so he doesnt decline because he knows he wont play there long. Ex) Allen Iverson yes i know this probally wont happen but think about it hes a vet. that can teach young players he can get some big and much needed minutes and he can try and prove himself here in MN. The down side to this is A) hes washed up B) MN probally wont want him b/c of his ego and attitude which is not needed in a young teams roster.
This is just something to think about i DO BELIEVE a SG Free agent will be signed b/c lack of depth at that position
I made up shocka khan like 4 threads ago.. lame matt, very lame
we gave away telfair and crai smith for nothing.. that’s too bad, im sure we could have gotten something for either of them.
We gave up Smith and Telfair for TBD. It all depends on what Kahn does with the money next summer.
I’ll miss Bassy. He was finally starting to pan out, and with Flynn being a rookie and Rubio possibly not playing this year, we could have really used him. I’d much rather have Telfair than Chucky Atkins (although maybe Atkins’ ties to Rambis will keep his head up and his mouth shut).
WooHoo! QR is outta here!
Doh! Blount is back!
Foo, thanks for the post of the article, nice summery of what Kahn is trying to pull off. Hopefully we’ll see some disorganized, fast paced basketball played for a couple years while the kids learn the pro game, then who knows? We might be watching games played in the postseason for a change!
Its true that Blount isn’t a great player, but he’s probally the wolves best center they’ve ever had….hmmmm thats not saying much about the team.
I’m not a fan of the trade if we just cut Blount. He has a $7.96 million expiring contract. If Kahn can’t turn that into an asset (draft pick(s), player(s)), then it was just a move to save Taylor money this year. This team needs assets on the court in order to win back the fans and cost-cutting moves that don’t improve the team on the court will not win back the fans. As a season ticket holder, trust me, this trade does nothing for me (except for provide irritation) if we don’t turn it into some asset that improves this 24 win team in some way for the future.
As each week passes, Kahn shows us how miserable and lazy a GM McHale was. He made some statements this week about how he had no interest in being a team that fights for the 8 seed every year and then loses in the first round…that sounded to me like a perfect assessment of the team McHale was intent on building. Go Kahn!
At some point we have to pick up some players for this year. As a season ticket holder I am buying into the “plan”…but I also am spending alot of money to go see games THIS year.
I’m not a huge fan of this trade and hope that there is something else going on. I’m not interested in saving Taylor money this year.
[…] Jerry Zgoda, Star Tribune: "This deal, too, is all about cost saving and salary-cap stuff. Both players have expiring salaries, but the Wolves will save nearly $1.4 million by waiving Blount and his $7.96 million contract rather than dump Richardson’s $9.35 million contract. By making this deal, it’s clear Kahn never intended having Richardson, who likely would have been a runaway gunner in his contract year, on this season’s team. Kahn still could deal Blount’s contract in another deal, but it seems like waiving him outright is more likely." […]
[…] Jerry Zgoda, Star Tribune: "This deal, too, is all about cost saving and salary-cap stuff. Both players have expiring salaries, but the Wolves will save nearly $1.4 million by waiving Blount and his $7.96 million contract rather than dump Richardson’s $9.35 million contract. By making this deal, it’s clear Kahn never intended having Richardson, who likely would have been a runaway gunner in his contract year, on this season’s team. Kahn still could deal Blount’s contract in another deal, but it seems like waiving him outright is more likely." […]
I can’t stand the, “I’m a season-ticket holder THIS YEAR” angle…
So you’re saying that because you’re spending money you want to see a good product on the floor… Fine. On principle, that’s fine.
But you can’t be on board with the “plan” and also whine because Kahn isn’t scrambling to find short-term fixes for this year.
If you’re on board with the “plan” then you’ve got to expect some lumps in the early-going.
So the Wolves have to sing a SG now don’t they?
*sign
This trade doesn’t bother me…and I just got a half season package the other day… 
Jama - We still have plenty of wings…Wilkins, Brew, Gomes, Ellington…
If anything I hope we wait and just sign a d-leaguer
Teams will give up a first to aquire an expiring contract if the team that gives up the expiring contract takes on a bad longer term deal. Kahn has said that he will not trade for a contract this year if the deal has more than one year left on it. So the Buyout or outright cut angle does seem like the logical one. Blount had a stuck up attitude and was a whiner the last time he was here, so i can’t see him playing at all.
I’d like to see what Wilkins can bring to the team and this move makes way for Carney to re-sign with the Wolves, i like Carneys potential.
I think Carney wants a raise.
Carney should be making more than Brewer.
It looks like maybe we still have McHale and the disquise is that he is wearing a Kahn suit? This guy has made osme dumb moves in my opinion and his stock with me is dropping faster than Obama favaorability is dropping nation wide. So far he let Foye go to move up in the draft and pick a guy who either can’t play or doesnt want to play, he then moves Telfair/Smith for Richardson and then moves Richardson for some has been Blount? This is sounds like McHale all over again and you all can spin it anyway you want, but get ready becasue this will bite is in the A$$! At this rate we will be luck to have enough players to field a team that can win 10-15 games next year and yes I know you all don’t want to WIN, we want to position for the next draft, so we can draft more players who cant play or dont want to play in MN. I’m very excited about Rambis, but there are no arm chair GM who are going to convince me this makes sense trading up and getting nothing and then following it up with more silly moves. Sorry but this Kahn or McHale whoever it is scares me to death. Ok, we have some salary cap room? Big deal do they want to win or just save money? It appears it’s all about saving money. This SUCKS!
Gotta love that Minnesota optimism eh TWG ?
I can see the Wolves end up being players in the restricted fee agent market the next couple of years. AS far as unrestricted, maybe Josh Howard will be in Kahn’s sights next off season.
I’m continually amazed by the love some people have for the tremendously mediocre Rodney Carney. Corey Brewer pulls down 50% more rebounds, generates 4x the number of assists, generates 30% more steals, and gets to the free throw line more frequently than Rodney Carney does.
Rodney Carney does two things — shoot the ball a lot and dunk. And occasionally, when he feels like it, he plays some defense. He can come back at the minimum, but he ain’t part of the long term puzzle.
As has been discussed on this blog in the past, thinking in term of some big free agent signing (e.g. Joe Johnson) as the answer to vaulting the Wolves into respectability is not necessarily the wisest or most way to approach this rebuilding. Unless you acquire a true superstar (e.g. Lebron, Kobe, DWade, KG, etc.) you are not going to turn a team around with the addition of a single player.
Better to think about rebuilding with multiple talented young players, as Kahn seems to be trying to do. “Player development” seems to be his new mantra. Yes, let Flynn and Love and Brewer and Ellington (and maybe Rubio, and maybe Carney) play with Big Al and see how that develops. Then add more promising young pieces next year through the draft and free agency.
Don’t pin any hopes on one big FA signing in 2010 as the answer. Then the question of whether or not Minnesota can attract a “big” name become mute.
So Kahn’s moves this year gave away nearly all our tradeable assests and 2 2nd round picks for a PG that may never play, net 1 million in cap room next year and a bunch of horrible players like blount. While making us think about giving important roles to guys like wilkins, brown, pecherov, songaila and the ancient atkins. Obviously he is a genius. Meanwhile teams like OKC in recent years have traded nothing for 3 1st round draft picks. You have to hope for a miracle that the wolves only spend 1 year as the worst team in the league otherwise in 2011 Kahn will be trying to explain why we just gave the number 1 pick to the Clippers. I am sure glad that we have a front office with a plan otherwise I don’t know what we would do.
I think TWG is right regarding this particular trade (Idisagree on the other moves). This deal has all the signs of a Glen Taylor budget special.
Scratch that, Howards unrestricted in 2011. Aldridge is restricted next offseason, he would fill the Center spot nicely and with Oden in Portland and Roy’s extension kicking in next year a big offer from the Wolves might be enough to pry him away.
reeves
The Clippers pick is protected until 2012. If you want to rip Kahn and the Wolves that’s fine, but at least get your facts straight. Plus the Wolves have netted more than $1 million more in cap space for next year and have saved about $4 million in actual dollars this year.
Brewer defends, he is a turnover machine and can’t shoot at all. Carney can,defend, hit the three and run the break effectively. I hope Brewer can improve this season, Kahn basically said this is his make or brake season with the Wolves.
I’m with you all and understand the likely hood of the Wolves winning in 09/10 is slim. However, what message is being sent to the existing players on the team? I do not believe Big A cares about some silly cap-max it out and put the best team you can get on the floor. We have to start somewhere in the building process and I do not see that happening. Next Kahn will want to see what he can get for Flynn/Ellington and we will end up with nothing for our 4 first round picks. It seems to me they want to wait until 10/2011 to start the building. The Wolves have Twins written all over themselves and don’t surprised when Mauer and Mourneau want out because they sick and tired of the owners and management running around with that “small market” mentality and going nowhere. I predict Big A will be next! He will want out of here and I can’t blame him, Mauer or Mourneau.
Where exactly would Carney play on this current team? The Wolves currently only have one true SG, that is Ellington. Brewer can defend the 2 but he can’t shoot which is kind of important when you have no outside shooting currently. Carney is basically Brewer with more dunking and less defense. Gomes is a 3/4 much more than he is a 2/3. Wilkens is also a 3 since his career 3pt% is less than 34%.
Yes some people other than Ellington CAN play the 2 but that doesn’t mean they should be.
Lots of people are saying we can’t be big players in the free agent market in summer 2010. We can. Due to the bad economy, the salary cap will be dropping next year, meaning that only 9-10 teams (including Wolves) will have big cap space. Chicago, New York, and Miami are 3 of them, but they can’t sign all of the major FAs next summer.
As Kahn talks more, I’m beginning to see method to Kahn’s madness. Our big problem in Minn is that we have trouble getting FAs to come here consistently because of small market and weather. That will likely remain somewhat of a problem. So what do you do?
1. At least get a coach and a style of play that will be attractive to free agents, as well as to players considering whether to resign with Wolves
2. Heavily focus on developing young players, since you can’t count on simply signing expensive veteran players
3. Create cap space, and continue to maintain it by not overpaying players
All of this Kahn has either begun to do or stated as a key goal. I think it makes sense, giving the unique difficulty an NBA franchise in Minn faces.
the season ticket holder argument holds water when we’ve got a team so unbalanced that half the team will be playing out of position 30 minutes a game. I like the aggressive rebuilding that Kahn is doing, but I think he’s rippable for a few of these moves, this one included. He’s essentially turned Smith and Telfair into nothing.
Last year I remember hearing sentiment that “you don’t grow when you’re getting blown out every night” as an argument for McHale-style rebuilding. And this year, expectations are lower, but people are somehow expecting these kids to mature when they won’t be playing anything near competitive basketball against half the league.
I think that all these moves are making fans a little too “video game GM-ish”. That being said, it will still be interesting to see what happens.
Is it too early for the Wolves to draft Cole Aldrich with a 2010 top-3 pick in next year’s draft? He would not mind playing in the great cold north. Reeves, you are correct when you remind Wolves fans, all 100 of them, to not forget that we owe the LAC a first rounder by 2012. What SG prospecta are out there for next year’s draft. Gosh, I wish the Wolves would have drafted Curry.
Brewer should get as many minutes as his knee can handle this season, we need to find out if this guy is worth an extension in the next couple of years. I’d bring back Carney with a one year deal at the most, just incase Brewer is a total flop. Carney would have to play the 2/3 spot, he just fits in with the showtime offense nicely and would be a nice bench player but if thats all Brewer is going to be then you can’t keep both of them.
This trade is a mild disappointment for me. I had hopes that Kahn could pull a rabbit out of his hat and turn Q-Rich into a long-term piece. I couldn’t see who he’d get, though, so this is basically the “let it expire, have more cap space and play the kids” scenario. But the bottom line is that any deal that only saves Taylor money this year does nothing for me.
On the Carney debate: I think it’d be nice to have him back at a bargain basement price. Sad to say, but given the current state of the roster, he’d give us some stability on the wing. And he’d probably look pretty good in an up-tempo offense.
People are going to find out Curry is the next Devon George. I bet Curry doesn’t make it through a whole season before he gets hurt, a strong wind would blow him over into the next state.
Jama - You really think Smith and Telfair are considered to be “worth” something to other teams in the league ? Neither are worth picks, neither are the main “get” in a trade…usually just a piece of a trade…that diwndles your options to cap relief.
I told you he was going to a team in the Eastern Conference.
Jeff: you are one cryptic dude. I think you were on another board posting “Q-Rich will be traded to a team in the Western Conference.” That way, you’d be sure to look like a psychic on one of the boards.
Smith is unrestricted next year and i doubt he would have resigned with the Wolves. We used him to get rid of Telfairs contract and that made sense if Telfairs wasn’t in the Wolves future plans. If Rubio doesn’t end up here by next eason i would have prefered to keep Telfair because he was a good back up.
I’ve lost interest in the 2009-10 version of the D-league takes on the NBA here in Twin Cities already….. Sad because I love NBA ball. I hear “plan” but I see a revolving door of nonsense trades that makes Wolves look stupid or confused. Our perimeter play will be brutal with this squad. 1 ball handler/playmaker in Flynn. I’ll check in on the Kool-aid gang 20 games into season. Til then keep making up all the “this makes perfect sense to me” BS going. Good luck
More like rebuilding a mess. Mark Blount??? PLEASSSSSSEEEEEEE……………
Swan
I think you have me confused with someone else, I never said either of those guys had a whole lot of value.
That being said Craig Smith could have been turned into more than Mark Blount’s bought out contract in my opinion. I think he could have been a piece in a trade for Fernandez with the Blazers or one of the Warriors many wing players.
Probably…I don’t pay that much attention to names usually.
Anyways…Fernandez ? Sounds like move to make Rubio happy. I don’t know another reason to make that move.
Sweet- Mark Blount bobblehead night. Unless, of course, he’s gone by the time I finish typing. I like Kahn’s willingness (and apparent ability) of moving pieces around. They haven’t even played a game yet, and this has been the most exciting two months of Wolves b-ball in a few years!
Swan
You don’t think Fernandez has any value? First off he is actually a SG which is by far the biggest hole on this current team. Second he is cheap and wants out of Portland. Third, yes he would fit in nicely if Rubio ever comes over.
Not really. He doesn’t excite me as much as most here.
Lets face it, not too many top tier free agents will want to play in Minn. Kahn will have to build this team through the draft. And be very creative in moving assets for building blocks. The 2010 draft is said to be very deep with power forwards.( G. Monroe, D. Favors, D. Motiegunas, C. Aldrich… the list goes on..) I think that Kahn must draft the best player available. Then, package their surplus for a certified building block. For example, perhaps he can spin Love, Rubio & cap fillers to the Lakers for A. Bynum. The Lakers would move Gasol to Center, Love to PF and have a young PG stud in Rubio to replace Fisher. The Wolves would have Bynum, Jefferson & Flynn to build around. If Kahn can make smart trades and draft wisely, he can turn this team around in a short peroid of time.
There’s reasonable logic behind each move. The trouble is we’ve seen the Wolves accumulate draft picks before and then sell them. It’s really hard to have faith (which is all we have) that the picks and cap room will amount to anything besides bolstering the Mankato economy.
Swan–I buy that Rhino and Telfair may not be worth much besides cap relief, but to throw in a high 2nd-rounder in a weak draft? Geez, they’re not that awful.
PGJeff–Hey, Aldrich didn’t play for the Gophers. Who cares where he’d be happy. I hope he ends up in Memphis or Sacramento.
You didn’t really suggestion Andrew Bynum did you ? Really ?
NO BYNUM…
Jama - Another point…you know I don’t believe in labelling positions…so we just need to floor two wings at a time this year. I’d rather use the d-league a give people shots and 10 day contracts as garbage time players.
I can’t believe I just read a Love + Rubio for Bynum suggestion.
The only reason the Lakers would trade Bynum is if he’s injury-prone (which he is) or a chucklehead. You wouldn’t trade two potential stars for him.
The “certified building block” has to come from the draft or a team desperate to save money (as in the Pau Gasol trade). Or possibly a top-tier free agent we’re willing to overpay. Trouble is, right now too many other teams have cap room as opposed to when Orlando signed Lewis and Atlanta signed Johnson. The Wolves picked the wrong year to have cap room. (Unless they’re not going to spend it anyway, which is what history would suggest.)
The logic is that the Wolves must do a better job in using the draft to build their team. Either by drafting the best availabe player to trade or keep if he fill a need. Look at the past few years. They drafted Brewer instead of A.Thorton, T.Young or R.Stucky. They drafted Foye ( well actually traded away B. Roy)… R.Gay was also available. Go back further… they drafted McCants, could of taken D. Granger. No one has a cystal ball…howerer, you have to get one right! They have made horrible decisions over the last five years. Now with a surplus of picks and duplicate position players ( PF, PG)… they have to start making smart moves for top tier players.
As for Bynum.. it was a suggestion… Actually, he is 22 years old with a world of talent. don’t know if the Lakers would actually pull the trigger on a deal like that…however, I would not call Love a future star. Maybe a solid NBA player and the jury is of course still out on Rubio. But to say you would not trade two potential stars for him ? He is the type of young franchise player you build around.
Brian — Rodney Carney isn’t a good three-point shooter. His 35% last year was his career high.
Granted, it’s a small sample size, but last year’s edition of Brewer was a significantly better all-around player than Carney.
I don’t have a problem with the team playing its young players this year and letting them grow and mature into better players. I do have a problem with trading for Mark Blount just to save Taylor money this year. Blount’s nearly $8 million contract has trade value. Turn it into some type of asset on the court. Put Blount’s contract and Cardinal’s contract together and trade for a quality player from a team that is looking to save money on the cap for next season’s free agents. We have a better chance to improve this team via trades than asking free agents to sign here vs. other more attractive markets. The way to win back the fans is to improve the team. The way for Glen Taylor to make money and put people in the seats is to improve the team. Don’t use trade assets to just improve the owner’s bottom line for this year.
The only problem I have with the trade is how it will impact the absolute requirement to add a SG to the roster before the season starts. You don’t want to blow the plan, but you absolutely need to be able to get through the season. I thought the QR contract could be used to find a guy, either a short term plug or a guy of longer term use. Now, if they cut Blount as a cost-saving measure, how do they get the guy they need? D-league or 3rd tier FA? Let’s face it Ellington isn’t going to start or play starters minutes. Very few rookies do, although it’s probably easiesst to jump into the league as a wing than any other position. If you go D-league for the other 2, how do you know you are getting an NBA-ready guy?
Bynum is overrated, injured, inconsistent and vastly overpaid. At 22, 26, 30 or whatever his age is. I wouldn’t touch that contract if I was in a radioactive suit.
Especially since the guy isn’t even as good as Kendrick Perkins in Boston.
Kahn has barely got us any new cap room for next year. He traded two expiring deals for Songiala and his 4+ mil contract next year and the right to pay rubio 3+ mil. Then to make up the difference he traded two expiring deals and Telfairs option of 2.7 mil next year to LA. So then the last two swaps have been expiring for expiring. Don’t forget paying out 2+ mil for 3 years to the great Hollins. Maybe I am missing something but it seems like we have not increased cap room at all. Granted he has gotten the wolves savings for this year but that only means something to Taylor because it doesn’t give the team anything. I was holding judgement on the last several trades that seem to make no sense because we were told that they are building something, if that something is Mark Blount I am pretty sure that the roof is leaking. How can 20+ million of expiring contract even after the loss of Foye and Miller not net you at least something of value especially when every team in the league wants cap room for next year. Smith should have gotten more than blount himself since there is little difference between him and Glen Davis and many teams wanted the big baby. How many PFs in the league can get 30 points in a game while never being better than the 2nd option and haven’t turned 26 yet.
reeves - Had these moves not been made the Wolves, according to Hollinger I believe, would have the 8th most cap room next offseason…with these moves we’re at #4 most money to spend next offseason.
Alson reeves - Despite his scoring ability Smith gave up a bazillion points on D and wasn’t very good on the glass.
Foo, the seaons ticket holder angle DOES have some validity. I am all about the rebuild and know that we have to gut it to get better. This will be a bad year. But it seems that we’re almost going to an extreme here. Somebody else made the point of how much losing can wear down a team…and I think if you cant do enough to put together a team that at least can compete your hurting yourself in teh long run also. I’m looking forward to the season and I dont mind seeing “some” lopsided games. But I dont want to see that 8 times out of 10. He shoudl be able to put together a team that can somewhat compete night in and night out while still being able to do a rebuild.
Our team was worse off last year and we competed fine on most nights…there weren’t as many blow outs as I had anticipated.
I think 5&10 and kingsxman have a point. The Wolves do have a responsibility to put a respectable product on the floor. Even in rebuilding mode. Especially for a team which has now missed the playoffs five years in a row.
That doesn’t mean that you don’t play the kids, but what it does mean is that you don’t pretend that playing any young player is useful in and of itself. Filling out the roster with a bunch of marginal D-Leaguers who have no realistic chance of becoming meaningful NBA players isn’t the way to go.
There are still plenty of respectable veteran players who you know can give you some decent minutes and can be had at the minimum to fill those holes.
The thing I don’t get is how are we really that much less of a respectable product than we were last year? We had one hot streak, but other than that, we were a _terrible_ team. Losing Foye and to some extent Miller hurts a bit, but adding Flynn helps, as would have having a healthy Al and an older Love. I think we’ll be as competitive as we were last year — which sets the bar low, but I think staying even and getting in better position for the long-term isn’t a bad thing. The biggest problem now is a lack of anyone who can reliably score on the wing, but when we forced Foye to the point and Miller stopped shooting, we didn’t have that last year, either.
Losing Telfair, Smith and the other pieces really didn’t hurt our ability to compete in any sort of meaningful way. Neither’s more than a third-stringer at his respective position.
I was probably the biggest Mike Miller critic on this board during the season. But that still doesn’t mean you can put anybody out there in his place. What this team has at the 2/3 right now is worse than what they had last year, and as you pointed out, that wasn’t very good.
I like Ryan Gomes, but he had a lousy year last year. I like Brewer, but he’s a big question mark coming off injury. Ellington was good value at #28, but expecting him to be more than 15 minute player is asking for trouble. Wilkins is an OK bench player, but does anybody really want to see him playing significant minutes?
I’m not one who endorses this team being willing to take a step back in the W/L column. If you’re going to be in the playoffs in two years, winning 15 this year ain’t the way to get started on that road.
Sean,
I agree with you in general — I think the wing spots are real weak points for all of the reasons you suggest. I hope we can add another vet with some amount of game for this year since Brewer just isn’t going to cut it, Gomes is nice but really a roleplayer and, while Ellington might turn out to be a steal, he’s still a rookie who fell to 28 for a reason. That’s a problem… I don’t know that we’re much worse than we were last year, but we’re certainly not much better — this year. Still, at least there’s hope and some semblance of a plan, and I’m not sure we would have been any more competitive had we stayed the pre-Kahn course.
well, i don’t know what’s been said on the blog to this point…but it looks like, at the moment anyway that the wolves actually have some length on the roster…now…Blount soon will be moved…or bought out…either way. another good move.
Jerry, you got any pull with the guys in charge of the Wolves official website…the “roster” is completely out of wack…
Kilrathi — I’m not suggesting that we should have stayed the pre-Kahn course, just that I hope there’s more coming to build out this roster before the season.
I’m fine with playing Gomes - Brew - Ellington - Wilkins at the 2/3 this year.
yeah swan, i like that too. those guys will get a lot of minutes…would be great to evaluate them.
i also think that if Gomes gets a little bigger he’ll be solid Flex 3/4 guy…I know he’s played the 4 some against leaner quicker 4’s but I don’t know if he’s quite strong enough for some of those guys right now…I’m not saying he’s not…I’m saying I don’t know.
I just want to know how Kahn has gained cap room for the future. This doesn’t really count because we can’t get under the cap and there is no one to buy anyway.
He got rid of 2.7 mil in Telfair and added 4 mil in Songiala what has ended up in our favor?
reeves - I’m not the capologist on this board…I think thats Sean, ask him.
The Wolves are not in a noticably different cap position now then they were before Kahn came aboard. It’s been a lot of shuffling that appears poised to save them some money this year, but it hasn’t really helped or hurt them long-term.
The interesting question the Wolves face before the start of the season is what they do on Brewer’s option. I was in the camp of thinking they would definitely pick it up, but based on Kahn’s moves so far, I’m now inclined to think that they won’t.
Oh yah…Brew’s option…I wonder if they are contact with Doctor’s about it. What’s he slated for…something like $3.5 ? They should do it.
When do they have to decide on Love and Perchov ?
At the luncheon last week Kahn said that Ellington is better than they thought he’d be and he shoudl contribute in a large way relatively early.
It may be that we won’t get Charlotte’s pick next year. That doesn’t mean it won’t be useful as an asset if Kahn decides to move within the draft. That can got kicked along at least a year, either way.
Maybe Kahn can trade next years top pick for another teams pick in year 2013….just think how much cap space well have and we can get a really good FA….plus Taylor can save even more money……screw the fans!
I bet we can find a really good D-league player that can help us out so Glen can save even more bucks…Wow the teams going be good, maybe not this year but sometime in the next never……..Wake Up people!
Good to hear kingsxman.
I think adding seven footers like Blount and Hollins in the short term will make our front line better than it was last year. Having a front line of Jefferson / Smith, Love / Smith, or even Jefferson / Love was laughable on the defensive side, and none of those combinations were very complimentary offensively. I expect that Blount’s solid mid-range shooting game makes him a much better option than Jason Collins was last year — assuming Blount can still drain those shots as he is pretty old now. The Rhino could score in the paint but he was weak on the other end, and could not spread the floor on offense.
Bringing in Wilkens as a longer shooting guard will help us guard other shooting guards. We were unable to do that at all last year with the undersized Foye.
Kahn’s moves this summer balanced the roster, and required no long term commitments. He traded our write-offs for other teams write-offs — but at least he picked up some raw size in positions where we needed it. The problem with McHale’s roster last year is that if small didn’t work there was nothing to fall back on, and it became embarrassing to watch at times.
As a season ticket holder, I expect that the roster this year will be as watchable as last year, and I’m satisfied with these acquisitions. We’re a couple of moves away from a competitive playoff roster, but it seems to me that Kahn will exercise restraint and avoid making the desperate moves McHale made post-2005 in order to get back to the playoffs.
Blount for Walker, oh wait he’s busy paying back debts in Vegas. I can’t let this opportunity to go by without mentioning…. Dalambert. Blount and Cardinal for Dalambert
People need to give the no free agent will sign in MN argument a rest. Did Hedo Tukoglu not sign in Toronto this offseason?? Sure, cultural reasons played a part in his decision, but there’s no arguing Toronto as a better destination than Minneapolis. That team is a mess, Bosh has been an all star, but he’s proved nothing in the playoff department. Don’t get me wrong, Lebron and Wade aren’t coming here and probably aren’t going anywhere else either. But if Khan wants say a Joe Johnson or Rudy Gay, there’s no reason why he can’t get them.
I would rather have kept Q and see how he did. I still trust Kahn and like what he is doing, but Blount? Get Rubio here and I’ll forget about this one.
Blount will never play in MN. It was a move for a contract. Best case, he’s traded for someone who does play here. Otherwise, he’s cut. Either way, Q Rich wasn’t in the plans, so you may as well save a little in the short term.
Very funny how Logical Thinker and seenenough both go on a several day sabattical and then show up in consecutive posts!
Uhh, yeah, I’m sure tons of folks on this board believe you’re actually different people… right.
The folks who are talking about how Mark Blount fits in with this roster are the same people who were breaking down all the elements of Q-Rich’s game.
For once and for all, Blount isn’t going to play here. Just like Q-Rich obviously wasn’t ever going to play here.
For the capalogists of the group, don’t salaries have to be within 25-percent of each other when both teams are above the salary cap?
If so, I can honestly just see Kahn spinning expiring contracts for cheaper expiring contracts to whittle away at Glen’s salary commitments for 2009-2010. It’s actually pretty smart business. Kahn has stated he’s not adding any long-term contracts, which I think is smart. SO IN THAT FRAMEWORK, all of these players Kahn’s been swapping are worthless anyway… there’s all just expiring-contract roster fodder. In that case, why not save your boss as much money as possible? I’m not a big fan of moves that are designed solely for the purpose of saving money, especially when it’s at the expense of the product on the court. But if we’re going to let all these players walk next summer anyway, I think it’s good business in this case. Besides, it’s not like any of these guys can play, right?
Maybe Rambis views Blount as someone he can mentor.One way or another.we have to have a backup #5 who can rebounnd and defend the basket.
Geno- Hollins is that guy, at least I hope so.
I don’t understand these moves at all…. Calling players roster fodder shows you don’t know NBA. All these guys can play. Why did Wolves give 2010 2nd for roster fodder? The justification of senseless moves on this blog is simply amazing. Foo, if I was going to be 2 people on this Kool-aid drinking board I’d admit it. Losing interest in the lame explanations of trades and superstar predictions for guys who’ve never played a minute of NBA ball (Ellington Flynn Rubio) and guys who haven’t done a thing (Hollins) is why I’m not on this blog much. I’ll show up 1 month into season and check on you Kool-aid guys. This team won’t win 15 games next year and this 2 year plan will unravel like a cheap suit. I’ve been consistent with that prediction and time will tell if I’m right or Kool-aid guys are right.
Its pretty depressing being a wolves fans these days…I find myself feeling like that Elduche? dude……
Just saw on Rotoworld that Shooter is saying the buyout will probably be negotiated down to $3.3 million and that Rubio has $600,000 in endorsements lined up if he comes to MN. The numbers are getting closer, if that’s true.
Depressing ? It rules…Wolves news in the Nat’l media every few days…sweet.
Can’t wait for the season opener and Love’s usual trashing of Brook Lopez.
Let’s see, the Wolves roster now looks something like this:
Jefferson, Hollins, Pecherov, Blount
Love, Songaila, Cardinal
Gomes, Brewer
Wilkins, Ellington
Flynn, Atkins, Brown
My questions are:
Will this team play better perimeter defense than last years squad?
If they do, will it make the interior help defense of Jefferson and Love seem any better? (IMO their one-on-one defense was/is OK, it’s their ability to rotate to cut off drives that’s suspect)
Will the perimeter players offensively make the team better by making it harder for opponents to multi-team Jefferson?
My own answers:
I don’t know to all three.
I read where T-wolves will be trading Rubio to Knicks…. Being a NY fan all I can say is GO KNICKS. It was on hoopshype this morning.
A tiny chipmunk tells me that the Knicks don’t have anything worth trading for.
I’m with you Madison Dan… I’d be quick to believe it if the Knicks had anything worth trading for.
Wilson Chandler and Danilo Gallinari are their two good prospects. Would we take both for Rubio? Chandler a talented SF would be a nice pick up, and Gallinari, yet another PF, did nothing this year because he was hurt. But apparently can shoot the lights out.
I think a Gallinari/Chandler trade would be interesting expect that both players best position is SF. If the Knicks traded both those guys they would easily have the worst record in the league next year and their pick is going to Utah so that makes little sense.
I think I’d make the Knicks take back Songalia’s contract in that situation. If that was the proposal I would be interested.
Trie -
Yes, Yes, Yet to be determined.
Pfffffftttt to the Knicks trade idea.
Since it is reported (on RealGM) that the Knicks have shut down all FA point guard discussions for the week (while Kahn is in Spain) it does seem like rumors regarding discussions to send Rubio to the Knicks may have some substance.
But I also cannot figure out what the Knicks could offer the Wolves, aside from more future first round draft picks.
They’ve already traded next year’s first rounder to Utah. The only way I can see Rubio going to the Knicks is if more teams get involved in the trade, or if Kahn is not a smart as we hope he is.
It makes absolutely no sense to trade Rubios rights unless you get a projected star in return. Kahn has done a great job so far. I am waiting for the next trade where he packages some of the 1 year contracts for something.
It would take something/someone very special in return for me to be at all happy with trading Rubio at this point. I’d much rather see him play for the Wolves first, then see the team decide what to do with having both Flynn and Rubio.
Although I disagree with those who say the Wolves NEED a starting center so Jefferson can play PF (he can play center just fine) - the Wolves would then face the same issue with Jefferson/Love as they do with Flynn/Rubio when Ricky comes over.
The Wolves roster as it stands today has depth, just no quality to that depth. I can’t imagine any long term or significant players being added before next summer. It seems more likely to me that the Wolves play this season letting the young players develop (as Khan and Rambis have indicated is the plan), see who they can get in the draft, then use their available cap space for whaterver the most glaring need is at that time.
My preference would still be for them to draft the best SG they can with their first pick next year (Evan Turner perhaps) and not worry too much about upgrading at Center, especially if they really do want to be a fast break team.
Bill Simmons publicly called out Real GM for publishing that Knicks rumor (via Twitter). With no first rounder and few decent players, it’s silly rumor mongering, just like we saw right after the draft.
Three team trade
Minnesota gets: Chandler and Gerald Wallace and 2nd rounder next year
New York gets: Rubio and Gomes
Charlotte gets: Jordan Hill and Cardinal’s expiring contract
what do you guys think? either way if that trade happens there will have to be another team involved for sure. Maybe the Knicks would sign and trade Sessions to us to sweeten the pot.
C-Note - I don’t like it.
Yeah I’m beginning to think I should have the 3rd team have been Indiana and tried to pry away Granger (who is better than Wallace)
Knicks would sign and trade Lee before giving up Hill
They would give up Hill and Chandler in a heart beat for Rubio
Granger for Rubio as the primary pieces ?
Wow…now I’m mulling it over.
I really like Granger
Flynn
Ellington/Wilkins
Granger/Brewer
Love/Pecherov/Songalia
Jefferson/Hollins
That would be playoff ready this year and only getting better
That would be awesome if that would happen but i doubt it does, Kevin Martin might be easier to acquire than Granger
A good article about Love from SI today:
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2009/writers/scott_howard-cooper/08/17/love/index.html?eref=sihp
C-note: “It makes absolutely no sense to trade Rubios rights unless you get a projected star in return.” - Dman
Dman is right. I don’t think acquiring a pair of good but not star players that will help push us out of the bottom ten this year Clippers (while eating all aour cap room) is the right move for us.
Kahn wants a great team, not just a good team.
“Only 2 teams have the right players & cap figure assets for Minny AND make sense for Rubio. Easy to figure out. Sorry, NYK not one of the 2.” - Bill Simmons
Any guesses as to the identities of the other two teams?
Courtside- that is I why I switched to Granger over Wallace, harder to get but is a star and will be for a long time. I would trade Rubio for Granger straight up right now if we could. We already have Flynn who might turn out to be better than Rubio and we would get our scoring wing. The Wolves with Granger, Flynn, Love, and Jefferson as a foundation would be awesome.
New Jersey, maybe? Rubio for Harris plus filler on both sides.
What team would really want to trade for Rubio right now before his buyout is resolved? They can’t pay him more or contribute more to the buyout. Would his playing in a bigger market do anything to guarantee more endorsement money?
I would think that if some company wants him as a spokesperson they wouldn’t be that concerned about where he plays other than the media exposure and name recognition. Rubio’s going to have both no matter what team he plays for simply because his name has been in the sports news so much already.
I’d still rather see him play in a Wolves jersey first than trade him. Unless you’re getting that elusive ‘young superstar’ in return, keep the hand you’ve been dealt and wait to see what happens next.
Wow, this New York rumor’s even less sensible than the previous gust of post-draft hot air…. I wouldn’t have thought that was even possible.
Start from the point where our RealGM scribe pitches the one big obstacle to Rubio’s playing here — his rookie scale contract being too small to pay off his buyout — as a *positive*. Now that, that is some seriously sloppy non-thinking.
the five ugliest words on this blog:
“Your comment is awaiting moderation”
It wouldn’t be that hard for NY to find a 3rd team who wants Jordan Hill. A lot of teams wanted him in the draft, now they just have to be willing to give up someone we want, crazier things have happened.
By this time next year, I would bet that Jefferson has been traded. I do not think Kahn likes him that much and his style of play does not match how Kahn says he wants them to play. We should be able to get a major piece to the puzzle with that trade, as long as his knee stays healthy. So I could see them drafting a pf or center next year and trying to get dominate wing player through the trade.
Dman- I would be ok with trading Love or Jefferson if Kahn finds the right deal but I hope we can get Turner next year.
new thread
new thread where? I don’t see one.
Which are the two teams Simmons is talking about? Interesting thought exercise. Who needs a Rubio-style PG and has assets? Golden State (plays the right style, Davis is getting old)? Miami?
http://realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/61171/20090817/knicks_could_be_pursuing_rubio/
I do not see a soul on the Knicks roster worth trading this pick for.
I guess we will see what team they pull out of their… hat to make this work.
Sources in NY are staying on the Rubio to Knicks deal. I bet the kid wants to play here in the Big Apple for up tempo Mike Di rather than in the frozen north. The way the Wolves are throwing away players…… I gotta ask, please throw in Al Jefferson.
You guys have nothing of value except Jordan Hill and we have enough PF’s so who is the other team going to be?
I think the fans and media from New York are only trying to help us poor naive midwesterners out. Afterall , we should know better than to draft a potential superstar.
Talk about being stuck in an alternate reality.
NY is pretty hilarious.
Sorry, but Kahn is not sending Rubio that way. Even if they had something to give in return. His rights are ours and we are another day closer to having him in a Wolves uniform!
I can’t wait to see him on the court and begin his journey to become an all-star.
lol
Hey, Hoopshype, do you think Red H. will make Clyde available in a Rubio deal? If not, we’ll give you Rubio and Jefferson for Debusschere, Barnett, Riordan, and the Caz (oh, and the draft pick that will be Phil Jackson).
If The Knicks want Rubio, they have to take Songalia and give us Danilo Gallinari, Wilson Chandler, Toney Douglas and Jordan Hill at minimum. Otherwise, I’m not interested.
Those four NYK players have a total cap value of $8M. To Songalia, add Bobby Brown and Oleksiy Pecherov. The deal works.
If NYK isn’t willing to give us those four players plus the $4.5M in 2010 cap space by taking Songalia, then I’m not interested.
If it’s any less than that, why trade Rubio. He’s the only star in the trade… which is why I would still prefer to keep him.
I’m with Twinstalker. The Knicks would have to bring somebody back from the dead.
kilrathi you are hilarious! i like when i said “new thread” and then you said “new thread where?”
That was SO funny, thank you for that!
………..
ANyways, Rubio to NY is something that is constantly being cooked up by the new york media. The Knicks have NOTHING and it would take a lot to get khan to trade the pick that will potentially define the rest of his tenure with this team.
New thread PLEASE (Now that the please is there do you get it Kilarthi? I hope not because then you can make another really funny comment)
People are talking about Rubio going to the Knicks again? I thought we already went over this: the New York Knicks have nothing….NOTHING…of worth to offer us. The end.
Jerry, since Kahn has and is going to again travel to Spain to talk to Rubio, is he also talking to Henk Norel and his representatives?
Ease back on dissing my Knicks. We’re set up for the 2010 summer with big money to spend and a City that everyone wants to play in. Rubio holds the Wolves over a barrel, he may not come there at all. Why not trade him where he wants to go. You guys picked up Q-Rich figured you take anybody. Just like with LBJ when we set our sites on a player we get them, Rubio to NY will happen. One last thing, the Knicks will have 10 or more wins than Wolves, so don’t be so hard on my team.
Hahahaha Knicks have one of the worst rosters in the league with less talent than the Wolves…yah…I said it…less talent !
hoopshype… do you realize we drafted another pointgaurd and we lose our draft pick next year to the Clippers if we are out of the lotto? What makes you think Rubio “holds the wolves over a barrel”. We hold all the cards here. Rubio’s stock only gets higher the longer he waits to come over. NY is a terrible team and Isiah mortgage it’s future on crap players. So like Foo said
“If The Knicks want Rubio, they have to take Songalia and give us Danilo Gallinari, Wilson Chandler, Toney Douglas and Jordan Hill at minimum. Otherwise, I’m not interested.”
Hoopshype,
Rubio really holds no cards. The wolves own his rights as long as he plays professional basketball. His only option would be to sit out a year and try and re-enter the draft next year. a MUCH deeper draft and he will still have that buyout hanging over his head.
+ I don’t know what the consequences from his current club would be should he decide to just “not play”.
The wolves are in rebuilding mode so Rubio now or Rubio later is no big deal.
PS I agree NY will most likely win more games than the Wolves, we are a young rebuilding team. NY is a bunch of dysfunctional players who will never be as good as they think they are. Which team would you rather be rooting for?
“Just like with LBJ when we set our sites on a player we get them”
Really? I didn’t know LeBron was playing for the Knicks this year.
What sites are you setting on this player anyway? The Statue of Liberty? Gosh I hope not, you would crush him to death!
NotSold
Rubio can’t just sit out. First he has to settle his buyout with his current team and then sit out a year. So in that scenario he would be paying the entire buyout himself while making no money playing basketball. Not going to happen.
Basically, as long as he is under contract or playing basketball somewhere the Wolves own his rights.
The Knicks are rebuilding also. Our advantage is we are a destination city that free agents and rookies want to come to: LBJ & Rubio. Another advantage is we have a real basketball man running our team in Donnie Walsh. All I know about David Kahn is he trades a lot of players. So ease off my Knicks and watch the magic return to MSG. Hope you country folk know what MSG stands for. Go Yanks. How bout those boys in Pinstripes?
Most seats given-up ?
I konow what LSD stands for, and I would say most New York sports fans are on it.
So hype, you goin’ down to that fancy MSG place to watch Utah use your first round pick next year? I know I’m just a simple country guy, but I think that pick might have helped the Knicks rebuild.
MSG: Monosodium glutamate, an ingredient that creates the illusion of energy and excitement into a very dull product.
Who was the last big free agent to go to the Knicks anyways ? I think you honestly have to go all the way back to Spree. Marbury ? Was he still big time then ?
Yeah their drawing power is amazing.
MJ — usually when people here say “new thread”, it’s because there’s a new thread posted and they’re giving a sign to other people to migrate to the new thread. So rather than being a jerk about it, try following along sometime…
Country people of Minnesota do not disparage NYC. Everybody wants to be from here or move here. Speaking of Marbury, we sent him there full of potential and he returned the Big Apple damaged goods. We haven’t chased a big free agent for a long time. When we land LaBron & Bosh the old days of Red Holz, Super Fly Walt Clyde, Earl the Pearl, Capt Comeback Willis Reed, Dollar Bill & Dave Debusschere will be back. Can’t wait.
“I miss New York so much sometimes I fill my humidifier with urine.”
–Emo Philips
Hahaha…yeah right…the Knicks made no plays for anyone the last decade.
Good Luck with LaBron. Not sure who he is, but I’m sure he can’t carry LeBron’s jock.
The Knicks don’t have enough cap space to sign two max deals. The fact that they have been waiting for 3 years for the summer of 2010 and now that it’s almost here and the best player they might be able to get is Chris Bosh makes me happy.
I doubt they’ll even get Bosh.
Speaking of Bosh, why not Bosh, why not us? Combine that with someone like Turner in the draft, and we got us a team.
No reason to go after Bosh for this team.
Bosh sucks. He will be perfect for the knicks. The tradition continues.
Lebron will either stay in CLE or go to Miami and play with his good buddy Wade and then Riley will come out of retirement and coach that team. Lebron, Wade, Beasley. I would watch that team.
Now that the Vikings landed their big fish for the year…it is time for some good news from the Wolves in getting Rubio….
Yeah I hear New York is a great place to be “from”. I may be a country bumpkin, but that is not a compliment! But on the other hand, stable-minded stars like Starbury and Spree are drawn there.
Haters from Hicksville show some love for the Big Apple. We just threw you a retread from our minor league team the Jets…… enjoy Favre and remember to butter him because he’s toast. He had nothing left last year. On our major league team, the Giants, we have Eli. A real QB that has a Super Bowl ring. Not many of those floating around there…. rings or QB’s. Is there snow on the ground there at this time of the year? Frozen tundra or some odd name like that or is that Green Bay it’s all Canada to me and the civilized people out East.
Hoopshype Let’s stick to basketball here. Where your Knicks are the 2nd most pathetic team in the NBA compared to the clippers. If it weren’t for a rigged lottery with Eweing your team would have been worse than the Clippers. As for your Jets and Giants. I believe we pretty much made Eli our little girl when the Vikings played them just before the playoffs… and after seeing the Cardinals last season… I realize how much luck goes into the NFL. Eli is a pretty little princess. Your minor league team as you refer to them… the Jets… a complete classes org that had a 39 year old QB that they knew was hurt, and kept putting him out there, and then blamed him when the whole thing failed. Classless Cowards! I’m not a Favre fan. I’m a life long Steelers’ fan. You know, a team with real class, the only team with not 4, not 5, but 6 Super Bowl rings, and they would have had a 7th had Jerry Jones not bought off O’Donnell… but as I said, let’s stick to basketball where New York, and New Jersey are tired, old, and have half as much upside as that dead dog you’ve been with for the last few years… just because animal necrophilia isn’t against the law in NY doesn’t make it right! Oh wait… that’s not a dead dog… that’s Stephan Marbury’s contract. my bad.
C-Note… No way that Lebron jumps ship to Miami or to NY. If he leaves the Cavs he’s going out west… He’d go to the Trailblazers on a sign and trade for a max contract… and Paul Allen would be greasing his wheels with Air Lebron… his own personal plane.
hoopshype… who wants to play in NY? No one wants to play in NY unless you are talking about the Yankees or the Mets… and without a salary cap that hardly is an arguable point. If the Kansas City Royals owner was throwing out 200-300 million dollars a player… A-roid, Dericka Jeter, and Texeria would be wearing royal blue. NY doesn’t earn squat… it buys talent. Other than Jeter… who is the last NY born superstar from the Rotten Apple?
jerry, don’t you think it might be time for a new thread?
451, I know your dog sled only goes so far but New Jersey is not New York. If you’re not from 1 of the Boroughs you’re not a New Yorker. We claim nothing from Jersey as our own. Mush on out here sometime and see the Hub of Civilization. Are you talking rings and baseball? Yankees have enough rings that you could give 1 to each of your sisters you married. Inbreeding being the norm out there in Hicksville. Wolves are really something to be proud of, I’m sure you are. At least we have a plan for Knicks… LBJ in 2010. You have picks that won’t even visit your state but will stay in the Big Apple for 3 weeks after the draft. Nobody and I mean nobody wants to play in Minnesota. Thanks for Santana also.
Expression451 - Two Things:
1. I agree that if The Royals were able to throw out more cash than anybody else, free agents would go there… that’s EXACTLY why I think The Wolves have a great chance to land a big free agent in 2010. Kahn has stated that is his goal and, more importantly, The Wolves will have the 4th-most cap space. Very few teams can AFFORD to sign a top-tier FA and MONEY TALKS.
2. What’s your beef with Derek Jeter? He’s a winner who hustles, plays the game right, is a model citizen and does everything you’d like want your son to emulate. I never understand why non-Yankees fans seem to want to beat him up.
Foo - Because Jeter is one of the most overrated modern superstars there is. Check out his fielding numbers…
Anyways, Bron isn’t going to NY unless they land a star.
Keep dangling Chandler and Jared Jeffries…I’m sure you’ll get Amare soon !
Jerry? Anybody? New thread, please!
hey hoopshype - LeBron is not coming to NY. Even New Yorker Vince Thomas knows it:
http://www.nba.com/2009/news/features/vince_thomas/08/18/smallmarkets/index.html
“We claim nothing from Jersey as our own.”
Yeah, I wouldn’t claim the Jets or Giants either.
Hey, Purple fans, there’s an idea to replace the dome. Why don’t they just cross the river and get a Viking stadium in Hudson?
Are you guys back on free agents coming here in 2010….. Please name me 5 top tier guys that have gone to a team that won under 20 games the year prior, excluding the players that went to their home town teams. Don’t care what Kahn says. I don’t understand half of what he’s done already. Wolves are laughing stock of league right now. No proven depth, no playmakers but Flynn, no proven shooters, and a pick who won’t come. I bet the free agents are lined up….. More Kool-aid please.
I thought this was a blog… Where are the updates? C’mon Jerry, et al. Wake up!!! There should be daily postings.
Eeyore: I’ve been enjoying your New Yorker impression. Are you really that desperate for attention? I shouldn’t complain, though. At least it gave us something to talk about until something actually happens.
Where’s the updates?
It’s the middle of August.
The coach has been hired.
Nothing seems to be shaking on the Rubio buyout front (and I now suspect what we’re going to see here is a colossal game of chicken that runs down to the wire).
There are restrictions on trading many of our players (in combination with others).
What sorts of updates are folks expecting?
What did Ellington have for breakfast ?
New Info please. NEW thread!!??. Give me an update as to what kind of ice cream Flynn was eating. Something. Anything would be nice. It’s been 5 days.
I ask this in all seriousness and would prefer serious answers: What does New York have to offer LeBron that he doesn’t already have?
The only thing I can think of is night life, but I don’t think that’s an important item for someone who is the most famous athlete in the world with every possible endorsement already, and who can privately jet to wherever he wants to “go out.”
LA has Hollywood. Cleveland has more money to offer (that’s still a rule, right?) and the big plus of not having to change team identification or leave “home.” What does NY have? Maybe the appeal of being the best New York player ever (move over Dr. J)?
New York has nothing, really, that LeBron doesn’t already have. His brand is hugely successful in NY already.
Kilathi- I really dont care what most people use the term new thread for.. regardless of that when i say “new thread”- I (me, myself, mj) is requesting a new thread. Sorry if you think that means I’m a jerk.
no rubio trade says hoopsworld.
MJ,
I think where most of us thought you were acting like a jerk was not your use of the term “new thread” but it was when you started in on Kilathi for misinterpreting what you meant by that phrase. Since Kilathi does not reside inside your head I think you can understand why he may not have known in advance what you were talking about.
having said all of that… New thread please.
Sean - I agree the Rubio saga is starting to show signs of being a lot like the Favre saga, only I’ll be happy when Rubio signs with the Wolves…
twinstalker
LBJ can actually make a lot more money through endorsements in NY than he can in Clevelan. I agree he’s not going to NY but there is more money there. It’s also a much bigger media market. I believe when he came out it was put into the endorsement contracts that if he played in NY, LA, or CHI the per year dollar amount goes up. I know that was in the Nike deal.
logical thinker says:
I don’t understand half of what he’s done already.
That is more about you than Khan, I think.
Gee, I know this blog is free and all but an update every week or so would be nice… 
the issue wasnt kilathi’s not “being in my head” or “understanding what i meant” .. I mocked him because he mocked me. He acted like he didnt understand what saying new thread in that context meant… so i acted like him saying that was as funny as he had hoped for it to be.
Anywho, does anyone know of any wolves blogs where the author actually cares enough about those who contribute to post new threads?
no wonder this paper went bankrupt!
How many of us would LOVE to have this job? It’s unfortunate someone with apparently less passion for it runs it
wolves news since this thread(and im doing this off the top of my head so if anyone can think of anything else please chime in…)
Flynn ties for second in a poll of rookies of who they think will be the best
Rubio to NY rumors heat up
Rubio to NY rumors cool off (obviously.. they have nothing to offer and khan would be a fool to trade him at this point imo)
Kevin love and al jefferson are featured on a cover story on espn.com
And the vikings got FAVRE! (this is a minnesota paper.. it was worth mentioning- it transcends sport! haha it was on perezhilton for gahhhdsake!)
There’s really no news to report guys.
What do you guys think about Desmond Mason? He’s just confirmed he won’t be back with the Thunder.
I’ve been a huge fan of his since his rookie year. He’s 31, but assuming he’s reasonably healthy he has tremendous athleticism that would work really well in a running system. Plus, he’s veteran and has a great attitude (unlike Chucky Atkins….)
He used to KILL us way back when he was with the Sonics…
I was thinking the same thing Bryan. Not much is happening in the NBA at all right now so whats to report. Jerry could make a new thread just saying something like, “All quiet on the mid western front” or something and say he hasn’t heard any more word on Rubio and other little items.
I’d have no interest in Desmond Mason. What does he do that Rodney Carney doesn’t? They’re both mediocre wings with some athleticism.
I’d rather just continue this game of chicken with Carney until he accepts that all he’s gonna get is a 1-year, minimum-salary contract…
Unless he goes to Europe or something.
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZgoda.
Wake up and tell the people how the workouts at Target center are going.
MJ — actually, I wasn’t mocking you. I was wondering if there was a new thread out there that maybe hadn’t shown up on my end because of some problem with the cache. Seemed like it was time for a new thread (well past time) and I thought you were saying there was one, and I was looking for it. Not everyone out there is trying to mock you…
And, yes, arguing over the meaning of a “new thread” comment definitely means we’ve hit the dog days of summer and a lull in the NBA news cycle!
Jerry…. Jerry…. anyone….. Jerry?
Was thinking the same thing about Mason but the comment of wanting to play significant minutes and not mentor the younger players is a bit concerning.
Thing about Desmond Mason is that he has no outside shot, which is already a sore point. Given the dearth of wing talent here, though, he’d get a chance to prove he still had worth without necessarily poaching time on the floor from someone else. I’d explore it.
For those still clamoring for Wolves news to talk about new article on why Corey Brewer will have a breakout season:
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/238873-the-story-for-corey-why-brewer-will-have-breakout-season
Oh and Spain wins it’s first game against Great Britain 84-63 without Pau Gasol. Rubio and Fernandez each had 13, Juan Carlos Navarro and Marc Gasol had 17.
Trying to provide more fodder:
“Carney’s agent claims that more than ten teams are interested in Carney’s services, which seems unlikely considering that he’s not been signed yet.”
There doesn’t always have to be news. He could give insight into potential free agents that would be a good fit. What does he think the team will do with holdover coaches and front office staff. Who does he think will / should stay? How about putting the question out as to whether the Wolves should trade Al Jefferson? They are supposed to be a running team, and he does not fit that mold. If they do trade him, who could we expect back?
These are all interesting topics. The articles are for news. Blogs are for topical conversation and interaction.
Again, wake up Zgoda!!!
I guess I don’t see why Al Jefferson can’t fit in with the Wolves as more of a running team. Even the fastest paced teams run the majority of their possessions in the half-court. It’s going to require Al to work a little harder sometimes coming back defensively if the pace is quicker, though.
I’d also point out that trading Jefferson, right now, is a non-topic. Realistically, he’s not going to be moved until he comes back and proves he’s over the knee injury. The Wolves would have to take a substantial discount if they moved him now. His market value can’t truly be assessed until we see how he plays after he returns.
Rubio believed to be close to signing
